The Watchtower & the cigarette company (page 11)

expatbrit

Yes! I finally started a thread which got more than 100 replies. Wooohoooo!

Expatbrit (concentrating on the priorities)

Gerard

But for now, it's possible that they were unaware of the holdings.

Ahhh, good ol' didn't-know-it apologist and defense...

ashitaka

Great thread. Looking at this, I am pleasantly reminded of the UN scandal. Man, I'll tell you, we have a bunch of crack detectives here. Great work expat.

ash

expatbrit your own comments show that this trust is actively traded, that it didn't hold the Phillip Morris stock and then it did. No evidence has been presented that says the Wt controls the trust and by what stretch of the imagination they should be held responsible for the day-to-day trading activities of the trust escapes me. This is an issue only for the ignorant. I truly hope that something massive happens to the organization and sooner rather than later but this trumpeting of this kind of nonsense detracts from real issues. The " a little leven" comments from many here show they have no understanding of the application of the scripture whatsoever, by their lights, Jesus was irrevocably damaged because a prostitute washed his feet.

Zev you can stick it in your ear. You know nothing about me or what I do so stuff it.

Scully

Pork Chop:

The " a little leven" comments from many here show they have no understanding of the application of the scripture whatsoever

Maybe you could enlighten us as to the proper "understanding of the application of the scripture", then. We were only going by the way the Society applies it. Are you saying that they misapply it too?

Love, Scully

searchfothetruth

Great thread Expatbrit,

I phoned my mum up today and told her all about it....of course its just lies put about by apostates (thats you).

Thanks for the info...well researched

Scully

Watchtower understanding of "leaven":

*** w00 8/15 p. 19 Sacrifices of Praise That Please Jehovah ***
Offer Sacrifices Clean and Undefiled
7 First, Paul urges Christians: “Let us approach with true hearts in the full assurance of faith, having had our hearts sprinkled from a wicked conscience and our bodies bathed with clean water.” (Hebrews 10:22) The language employed here unmistakably reflects what was done in a typical sacrifice under the Law. This is fitting because for a sacrifice to be acceptable, it had to be offered with the right motive and be of something clean and undefiled. The sacrificial animal was from the herd or the flock, that is to say of the clean animals, and was “sound,” without defect. If the sacrifice was from the fowls, it had to be from the turtledoves or young pigeons. If those conditions were met, “it [was to] be graciously accepted for him to make atonement for him.” (Leviticus 1:2-4, 10, 14; 22:19-25) The grain offering contained no leaven, which is a symbol of corruption; neither would it contain honey, likely meaning the syrup of fruit, which has a tendency to cause fermentation. When the sacrifices—animal or grain—were offered on the altar, salt, a preservative, was added.—Leviticus 2:11-13.

*** w98 10/1 p. 14 Imitate Jehovah’s Mercy ***
2 The coldhearted attitude of the Pharisees constituted a crime against humanity and a sin against God. (John 9:39-41) With good reason, Jesus warned his disciples, “Watch out for the leaven” of this elitist group and other religionists, such as the Sadducees. (Matthew 16:6) Leaven is used in the Bible to represent sin or corruption. So Jesus was saying that the teaching of the “scribes and Pharisees” could corrupt pure worship. How? In that it taught people to view God’s Law solely in terms of their arbitrary rules and rituals, while ignoring “the weightier matters,” including mercy. (Matthew 23:23) This ritualistic form of religion made worship of God an intolerable burden. (Sound familiar?)

*** w95 6/15 p. 15 What Motivates You to Serve God? ***
“Watch Out for the Leaven of the Pharisees”
11 The Pharisees took all the life out of worship of God. Instead of stressing love for God, they emphasized works as the measuring stick for spirituality. Their preoccupation with detailed rules made them appear righteous on the outside, but inside they were “full of dead men’s bones and of every sort of uncleanness.”—Matthew 23:27.

*** w95 10/15 p. 29 Watch Out for Self-Righteousness! ***Watch Out for Self-Righteousness!
IN THE first century, the Pharisees enjoyed the good reputation of being righteous worshipers of God. They were earnest students of the Scriptures and prayed frequently. Some people viewed them as being gentle and reasonable. Jewish historian Josephus wrote: “The Pharisees are affectionate to each other and cultivate harmonious relations with the community.” No wonder they were probably the most respected and highly regarded individuals in Jewish society at that time!
However, today the word “Pharisaic” and related terms are derogatory, synonymous with sanctimonious, self-righteous, holier-than-thou, overpious, and giving lip service. Why did the Pharisees lose their good name?
It was because, unlike most Jews, Jesus Christ was not deceived by the Pharisees’ outer appearance. He compared them to “whitewashed graves, which outwardly indeed appear beautiful but inside are full of dead men’s bones and of every sort of uncleanness.”—Matthew 23:27.
True, they offered long prayers while standing in public places, but this was just to be seen by others, as Jesus said. Their worship was a mere charade. They were fond of prominent places at evening meals and the front seats in the synagogues. While all Jews were obliged to wear fringes on their garments, the Pharisees tried to impress people by wearing excessively long fringes. They were proud to display their enlarged scripture-containing cases worn as amulets. (Matthew 6:5; 23:5-8) Their hypocrisy, their greed, and their arrogance finally brought them disgrace.Jesus voiced God’s rejection of the Pharisees: “You hypocrites, Isaiah aptly prophesied about you, when he said, ‘This people honors me with their lips, yet their heart is far removed from me. It is in vain that they keep worshiping me, because they teach commands of men as doctrines.’” (Matthew 15:7-9) Their righteousness was really self-righteousness. Understandably, Jesus warned his disciples: “Watch out for the leaven of the Pharisees.” (Luke 12:1) Today, we too must “watch out” for self-righteousness or guard against becoming religious hypocrites.

*** it-2 p. 230 Leaven ***
Symbolic Significance.
“Leaven” is used in the Bible to denote sin or corruption. Jesus Christ told his disciples: “Watch out for the leaven of the Pharisees and Sadducees,” and, “Watch out for the leaven of the Pharisees, which is hypocrisy.” The disciples at first did not understand that Jesus was using a symbolism, but they finally discerned that he was warning them to be on guard against false doctrine and hypocritical practices, “the teaching of the Pharisees and Sadducees,” which teaching had a corrupting effect. (Mt 16:6, 11, 12; Lu 12:1) He also mentioned Herod (evidently including his party followers) in one of his warnings, saying: “Keep your eyes open, look out for the leaven of the Pharisees and the leaven of Herod.” (Mr 8:15) Jesus boldly denounced the Pharisees as hypocrites concerned with outward show. (Mt 23:25-28) He pointed out the wrong doctrinal viewpoint of the Sadducees. He exposed the hypocrisy and political treachery of the party followers of Herod.—Mt 22:15-21; Mr 3:6.
The apostle Paul employed the same symbolism when he commanded the Christian congregation in Corinth to expel an immoral man from the congregation, stating: “Do you not know that a little leaven ferments the whole lump? Clear away the old leaven, that you may be a new lump, according as you are free from ferment. For, indeed, Christ our passover has been sacrificed.” He then clearly showed what he meant by “leaven”: “Consequently let us keep the festival, not with old leaven, neither with leaven of badness and wickedness, but with unfermented cakes of sincerity and truth.” (1Co 5:6-8) Paul here was drawing on the pictorial meaning of the Jewish Festival of Unfermented Cakes, which immediately followed the Passover celebration. Just as a bit of sourdough soon causes the whole lump, or batch, of bread to be leavened, so the congregation as a body would become unclean in Jehovah’s eyes if they did not clear out this corrupting influence of the immoral man. [Similarly, the entire ORGANIZATION could become "unclean in Jehovah's eyes" if they did not clear out a corrupting influence that would show them to be hypocrites.] They must act to get the “leaven” out of their midst, just as the Israelites could have no leaven in their houses during the festival.
Leaven was associated with corruption even in the minds of peoples of antiquity other than the Hebrews. For instance, Plutarch, a Greek biographer, spoke of it as “itself also the product of corruption, and produces corruption in the dough with which it is mixed.”—Moralia, IV, “The Roman Questions,” 109.Because of the negative aspects associated with leaven, Jesus evidently had in mind corrupting elements when he said: “The kingdom of the heavens is like leaven, which a woman took and hid in three large measures of flour, until the whole mass was fermented.” (Mt 13:33; Lu 13:20, 21) The Scriptures do indicate that corruption of truth would be brought about by individuals professing to be in line for membership in the heavenly Kingdom.—Ac 20:29, 30; 1Ti 4:1-3.

Is that the proper understanding of "leaven"??

Geez, when you look at it this new fangled "enlightened" way, the WTS looks even WORSE than it did before!

Love, Scully

ashitaka

LOL @ Scully.

remind me never to debate you.

ever.

ash

Scully

ashi:

remind me never to debate you.
ever.

Coming from you, that is a very high compliment. Thanks!

Love, Scully

KGB

Why does this not surprise me, they used to smoke up until the mid 70`s OH thats right they had new light Well I quit but not because they said too but because I wanted too. Man it sure feels good to be smoke free!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The Watchtower & the cigarette company

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