Also, Mary, you made an excellent point in your intial post - one I had not considered previously. Indeed, they think that their religion is so wonderful, while the first century Christians contended with "apostasy" after just a few decades. Very well put!
Sept 1 2003 WT: Is There Only One 'True Church'?
by Mary 45 Replies latest jw friends
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Mary
Thanks Rocketman. I remember mentioning this to an elder once................he spluttered and splatted all over the place trying to think of a logical explanation and you know what he came with? I quote: "....The reason the Organization hasn't turned "apostate" like in the First Century CE is because we're closer to Armageddon..."
Uh, ya............okay. And that has what to do with it?
Was I DOUBTING the Organization?? Did I need a
Threatening VisitShepparding Call toscare the living shit out of mereadjust my thinking?? -
reporter
Am I reading this wrong or what?
Because as in the 1st century, there can be only one true church.
If there can only be one "true church" and the WT adamantly denies themselves as being "a church", then it's pretty obvious that they CAN'T be that "true church".
That's interesting...I remember a time where the JWs didn't even consider themselves a religion, but rather, a way of life. Now, they've used the term "church" which used to be frowned upon...
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rocketman
he spluttered and splatted all over the place trying to think of a logical explanation and you know what he came with? I quote: "....The reason the Organization hasn't turned "apostate" like in the First Century CE is because we're closer to Armageddon..."
I haven't got enough eyes to roll at that elder's comment. And so The Gestapo thought you were a threat because of that? Wow, talk about paranoia. But then again, they couldn't have you thinking and reasoning for yourself now could they?
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Reborn2002
This is precisely the reason I have no respect for any Jehovah's Witnesses. Period.
The very core beliefs they adhere to are based on lies, misconceptions, and revisionism of history to preserve the image of the organization.
They are also taught to be hypocrites.
Even as a child, I wondered why they said that everyone else was welcome to visit the Kingdom Hall, but if anyone visited a different church just to see.. you were BAD and subject to judicial action. Then when they go in field service they want people to take their magazines, but if you do not blindly agree with the WT and the FDS, then you are wrong in their eyes.
If something good happens for JW's in the press then they preach it to the high heavens and say Jehovah is blessing efforts. If something bad is exposed in the news, then it is explained as media sensationalism in Satan's world, and lies designed to stumble and tarnish.
If membership numbers increase in any given year, then they say Jah is blessing their efforts in the time of the end. If numbers decrease, then they say the prophecy that "the love of the greater number would cool off" is being fulfilled.
Even armed with ammunition from their own literature showing them to be liars, they then backtrack and claim that New Light has revealed previous beliefs to be in error. Yet if they are God's only organization and an inspired prophet that he is using as his tool on earth, how did they get the message wrong in the first place? Did they misinterpret and get it wrong...thereby exposing them as being fake, or did their God simply change his mind on a matter such as blood transfusions or organ transplants and cause people to die needlessly?
JW's are people that choose to be willfully ignorant. TWT policies kill people and divide families. Therefore, I hate everything they stand for and find them to be a waste of space on our precious planet.
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Pistoff
2002 wrote:
JW's are people that choose to be willfully ignorant.
Yep, though the mind control is SO strong that they feel they are open minded. It makes it just that much tougher.
I reached a point last year when I asked my wife, why do we believe what we believe about the org?
She gave me a dirty look.
I told here I was serious, and she just said sarcastically, you tell me. I said again I was serious.
Because somewhere along the line, our parents swallowed it hook line and sinker, without researching it. But they somehow reached the conclusion that GOD was speaking through the WT and once that premise is accepted, cognitive dissonance keeps most from ever questioning what they hear or believe. You know: God speaks through the WT (ok, sorry; rather, they "are God's channel of communication"; same thing, just doesn't sound quite so straight jacket) and it is THE TRUTH. If what they teach is contradictory or changes, then they change the reality; maybe we didn't understand it, or maybe it was US who got it wrong; or my favorite, NEW LIGHT!!!
I have seen it again and again; I have a good friend who thinks all those who report abuse are apostates trying to cause trouble; he doesn't even consider for a second that the claims are true; it is NOT POSSIBLE for his mind to think it, because of the mind control.
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heathen
What really makes me gag about that article is the catholic church boasting that they represent true christianity . You think the WT is bad , the catholic church used to have the convert or die policy often using very cruel forms of punnishment on people who they accuse of heresy . The pope actually thinks he is the apostle peter . Talk about one f''''''d up religion .To me they are the whore of babylon .
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Mary
the catholic church used to have the convert or die policy often using very cruel forms of punnishment on people who they accuse of heresy . The pope actually thinks he is the apostle peter . Talk about one f''''''d up religion .To me they are the whore of babylon .
Yep, the good ol' Catholic Church certainly has blood on her hands, that's for sure. However, the Witnesses are certainly not far behind. Today, they have the stay-or-we'll-destroy-your life policy using very cruel forms of punishment on people accused of "apostasy". The Governing Body actually think they are Christ's brothers.
As for your comment about the CC being the whore of babylon, I agree 100%. Even when we were studying the Revelation book, it always clumped in ALL religions under Babylon the Great. I always thought "no way, it's the Catholic Church" because it likens her to the "mother of the whores". Now if you have a whore house, the madam is the "chief whore" and all the other girls work for her. And basically, all Christian religions that we know today, originated somehow with the Catholic Church. Anglican, Protestant, Church of England, Lutheran, etc. So yes, to me it would make perfect sense that the CC is the one they're referring to when it calls her the "mother of the whores", not all religions combines.
Just my two cents worth.
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ozziepost
Very interesting points being made here. May I add this thought: the Watchtower question seems to be premised on an incorrect usage of the word "church", for I'm not aware of "church" being part of NT theology.
Jesus said "I am the way, the truth and the life", so that his followers became known as The Way. Where is there an indication of "Church" in that? Or a true "church" (denomination/religion) ?
Of course, the WTS must emphasise the differences in order to justify their existence, so that the R&F are constantly bombarded with the expression "true Christians".
Quite simply, the artcle's title is all wrong and would better be entitled :"Is There Only One Way of Salvation?"
Cheers, Ozzie
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Mary
And so The Gestapo thought you were a threat because of that? Wow, talk about paranoia. But then again, they couldn't have you thinking and reasoning for yourself now could they?
Of course not! After all, I'm just an un-annointed woman! By the way, in the Fall Term, I'm taking Psychology of Religion (grin) ........am actually thinking of majoring in Religious Studies; God knows I already know half of it. But this is one course, for obvious reasons, I'm REALLY looking forward to.
Yet if they are God's only organization and an inspired prophet that he is using as his tool on earth, how did they get the message wrong in the first place? Did they misinterpret and get it wrong...thereby exposing them as being fake, or did their God simply change his mind on a matter such as blood transfusions or organ transplants and cause people to die needlessly?
Exactly. It's amazing how they just LOVE to point out all the "false teachings" of every other religion on earth to "prove" that they originate with Satan de Debbil, but when THEY change their prophecies (after painting themselves into a corner) then it's "New Light" or "flashes of light" or some such crap like that.
By the way, on the back cover of the Sept 1st Botchtower, it tells us the REAL way to solve poverty, and it ain't by givin' food to the poor. Noooooooo, you're to give them the Botchtower and Asleep! magazines so that they can see how they won't be hungry anymore in the New System which is "right around the corner".