Good article - Are Jehovah's Witnesses a religious Ponzi scheme?
by defender of truth 13 Replies latest watchtower scandals
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Skedaddle
Wow, scathing! But, all true! Thanks for that DOT. They are a ponzi, pyramid scheme. An international one! They are a fraud! -
adaen.europe
Nice share! :) -
carla
Thanks! -
nelim
Looks like a long incoherent rant. You announce a ponzi scheme but nowhere it is really explained. And people bringing in new people to the religion, then any religion would be a ponzi scheme according to your definition? (And then you deviate into blood transfusion policy without a clear link). I don't think religions preaching/converting is what people generally define as the ponzi scheme. A ponzi scheme is much more specific. -
defender of truth
@nelim
I didn't write the article. So the use of the word 'you' is incorrect.
nelim 2 hours ago
Looks like a long incoherent rant.
I am sorry you feel that way. I could see what he was getting at, although the title is not the best...
[He] announces a ponzi scheme but nowhere it is really explained.
The term 'ponzi scheme' may not be the best way of putting it
(because 'ponzi scheme' means someone taking money off someone else, telling them it will be invested and will reap financial returns later, whereas in reality the money is used for the Con-man's own personal gain and to pay off other investors who get suckered into the scheme)
... and unfortunately Witnesses, and others like yourself who are very careful and critical readers may pick on the use of that term..whilst missing the overall message. A poorly chosen title, perhaps.
What he is clearly trying to say, is that the Witnesses' false promises keep on drawing in new 'investors' (in the sense of investing time+energy), yet there will actually never be a 'pay-off' of any kind...
No Everlasting Life
No Paradise
No New World Order, complete with pet panda bears
The reality:
Millions of Witnesses working all their lives for a publishing and real estate selling company... with no tangible reward, either monetary or physical. Nothing gained now, nothing gained even in the future.
(And then you deviate into blood transfusion policy without a clear link).
He could have made it slightly clearer I guess, but it seemed clear to me.
Most people who invest in a fraudulent scheme only waste time or money.
The no-blood-transfusions policy, which is connected to the resurrection hope (the resurrection into Paradise is essentially the 'bait' or 'promised reward' for those investing in the scheme, for the purpose of his illustration), the no-blood policy not only costs time and money with a false promise attached to it...
This false promise costs lives.
To people not familiar with Witness teachings, the teaching of a resurrection, even if it's not true, may sound like a nice religious doctrine meant to give encouragement to those who have lost loved ones, and help them with the grieving process.
But for Jehovah's Witnesses the reality is much different, for 2 important reasons...
2) But the resurrection doctrine involves something even more sinister, in fact downright evil.
That is the issue of blood transfusions. Most people familiar with Witnesses know they do not accept blood transfusions. But the extent to which this doctrine is enforced is shocking. Even a child's life is not sacred enough to make an exception.
If a Witness life is at stake, and a blood transfusion is the only viable option, Witnesses will refuse, both for themselves and their children.
How could they possibly do such a thing, you may ask? Because they are taught that they will come back in the resurrection.
The same resurrection Jesus predicted 2,000 years ago and that never came.
...Further, those who accept blood transfusions risk being shunned, or disfellowshipped, which will ban them from having contact with other Witnesses, including close friends and family members.
So, no, the resurrection doctrine of the Jehovah's Witnesses is not just some innocent religious belief. How tragic that a doctrine about life has caused so many innocent deaths.
Maybe these quotes will help boil down what he is clearly trying to say:
Most people know what a ponzi scheme is, but here are the basics of it:
You need a scheme, you need investors who will fund this scheme, you need more investors to repay the initial investors plus interest, and then you need even more investors to repay those ones (and on and on)...
First, here is the scheme: The Jehovah's Witness leaders make many promises to their followers. They do this by taking Bible verses way out of context and applying it to themselves.
... the JW leaders are promising that they personally will provide this "wonderful paradise" for their followers.
...Today Jehovah's Witnesses make the same fake promises, and have been doing so for decades. Especially since Joseph Rutherford's discourse Millions Now Living Will Never Die given from 1918 to 1925, has the promise of everlasting life been used as a hook by JW leaders to bring in more members.
...So now you know the scheme:
Push the "future Paradise" belief at all costs, thereby enticing new members and ensuring lifelong membership for many current members.
Of course none of what Jehovah's Witnesses believe about Paradise is based on any sort of reality.
But the leaders need to keep pushing these ideas to keep current members and to gain more. As more and more Witnesses start to see the truth about the religion and show themselves the door, new Witnesses are needed to keep up with the losses.
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[Regarding the real estate fraud, that he maybe didn't fully explain.]
.. Watchtower annually publishes an article about making contributions to the organization, and specifically mentions "residential property".
The articles also mention donations of "cash, jewelry, or other valuable personal property", "specifying an entity used by Jehovah’s Witnesses as the beneficiary of a life insurance policy or a retirement/pension plan", "bank accounts, certificates of deposit, or individual retirement accounts set up as a trust or made payable on death", "stocks and bonds", "salable real estate", "securities", "a legally executed will", "donations via electronic bank transfer, debit card, or credit card".
^^ The above is part of real estate fraud. (From some people's point of view).
Take people's donated money (people who have been taught that all their money is spent on furthering Jehovah's work: primarily warning the world that they must join Jehovah's organization or die, which from the point of view of us "nonbelievers" is nonsense. It is even more so nonsense to say all donated money is spent on furthering God's work, when you consider that they sometimes build luxury accommodations with gyms, basketball courts and swimming pools, but that is another topic. *see footnote*), then use the donated money and free labour of the deluded and deceived 'investors', in order to build new properties that can be then sold off, or to purchase buildings that can be later sold for a big profit.
They can sell off some elderly sisters house that she left to the organization, and use the money to buy even more property to be sold at a profit.
Or the donated money will be used to bring in new 'investors' by means of the publications used in the preaching work.
(I appreciate that the link to a ponzi scheme is somewhat tenuous, I just found the overall concept interesting).
And here is the key point to me, the one that I feel made reading the 'incoherent rant' worthwhile.
Perhaps you would at least agree with this point:
However you want to refer to this, real estate fraud, ponzi scheme, or whatever, ultimately it boils down to this:
The Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses making false promises in exchange for real money, real time spent, real energy spent, real donations of property, real lives lost, real family members being shunned, and little to no accountability from the authorities or anyone else.
* footnote
Please see the following pages:
http://jwsurvey.org/cedars-blog/watchtower-recruits-volunteer-workforce-for-warwick-hq-construction-project
www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/208345/walkill-bethel-recreational-facility?page=1
(read all the pages of this last link)
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Finkelstein
I personally describe the JWS as a religion with an aggressive marketing scheme structured within itself.
The Ponzi scheme analogy is slightly correct in that the leaders have set an alluring promise to be rewarded if you join and be subservient to all of the controlling directives by the top leaders, which very much has to do with learning the devised doctrines and to further spread about the published literature which contain those devised doctrines as an intent to further allure more adherents.
What has happened with this organization is that its devised and concocted doctrines of preaching the gospel became tainted with commercialism and inaccuracy to the true original Gospel set out in the bible.
A devised religion that was structured intentionally to support the core operative workings of a publishing house.
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paladin1
I like to think that the WT$ is a multi-level marketing business or a pyramid company with GB at the top and no money for the workers at the bottom. -
Sugar Shane
I see it as less of a rant, and more of a thorough news article, with plenty of examples cited, Watchtower articles & books properly referenced down to the page/s. If only the Watchtower would provide references like that, or perhaps not take the ones they DO so out-of-context.
The author ties the blood transfusion issue into one if the WT's MANY false promises, while building the case that all these FALSE PROMISES are tantamount to a ponzi scheme. He ties these seemingly loose ends together at the end of the article, making a good case for the WT being a big scam.
It reminded me of some of the articles I've read in "The Economist," concerning such schemes in the business world. To someone accustomed to a more 'get-to-the-point,' style of writing, this piece might be a little incoherent, or at least long-winded.
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OneEyedJoe
I think the Ponzi scheme comparison is unfair to Ponzi-schemes. At least in a Ponzi-scheme some of the initial investors actually get paid off (and in some cases can make out pretty well) - in JWism no one benefits unless you're able to work your way up to the top and join the GB in their scheme, which is next to impossible.