Sales of Watchtower headquarters could total $1.2 billion, real estate pros predict

by MaybeSo 23 Replies latest watchtower scandals

• 

  Pete Zahut

  MaybeSo 6 hours ago

  “We let the qualified buyers participate in a competitive bidding process and see where the market goes with it,” Devine told the Eagle. Doesn't this logic reflect the same expectation of gambling or buying a lottery ticket? You don't know if you are going to win big or if you're just going to come out even or lose your $1 investment.

  I took this to mean that since these are such unique properties and many of them haven't been in the market since the turn of the century, they can't easily put a value on them as one normally would by doing a market analysis of similar properties. That being so, they are going to let interested parties bid on them and this will give them a more realistic idea of what the properties are worth to those who would be in the market for them. The Watchtower isn't gambling anything and must know exactly what their bottom Dollar amount is. For the purchaser, buying any property is somewhat of a gamble but not so much if he knows the approximate worth of the properties and knows what his budget can bear should the worst case scenario occur with the economy.

  It's sort of like antique cars or certain collectors items, they are only worth what someone is willing to pay for them. and if you want them and you plan to keep them, you don't worry so much about their resale value in the immediate future.
• 

  The Searcher

  Finkelstein - when all the evidence is put together, logically there can be only 2 reasonable explanations for the Org's fleece-ripping of the sheep, the dramatic cutbacks in magazine/literature production & distribution, and crucially, the sacrificing of so many full-time servants; they have either carried them out willingly, (to boost finances for some obscure reasons) or an external factor is compelling them to kill the goose which has been giving them their golden eggs.

  If all of this is the result of a "business plan" simply for greed, then I offer my sincere congratulations to the Brooklyn puppet-masters for their self-inflicted pains, and helping so many J.W.'s to waken up and smell the coffee.

  I've never known another multi- billion dollar business to cut it's own throat as overtly as this. (My 2 cents)
• 

  cognac

  Fink - What in the hell are you talking about??? No, most lawsuits don't actually make it to the media. You are completely wrong. More cutbacks WILL HAPPEN over the next few months and there will be more properties in the market.

  For you to think the only pending lawsuits are the ones that have hit the media, makes YOU the delusional fool. That's not how it works. Very few lawsuits hit the media.
• 

  Finkelstein

  So what your saying then Cognac is that the WTS postulating the we need more card is due to undisclosed law suits ?
  

  All the consolidating the WTS has done in past few years has been to impending law suits ?
  

  The fact is any imposing laws suits hasn't hurt the WTS to any significance.

  The other fact is that there are not if any law suits that have been levied against the WTS that hasn't made to the outside media or the inter-net.

  That's an unfortunate because the WTS instilled a shush policy by using fear and intimidation
  
• 

  Vidiot

  The Searcher - "...they have either carried them out willingly, (to boost finances for some obscure reasons) or an external factor is compelling them to kill the goose which has been giving them their golden eggs."

  My money's on the latter.

  The Org is reactive, not proactive.

  x

  I think it's a combination of things.

  ...the rising tide of pedo lawsuits (the Campos case has pretty much set a foolproof precedent to beat them, after all)...

  ...the inability of congregations at the grassroots level to meet their "quotas" (due to limited income from lack of education)..

  ...the potential impending loss of tax-exempt status...

  ...the inexorable passage of time (their business model was better adapted to the 20th century)...

  ...the Information Age (making it far easier to find reasons to leave and not feel hopelessly alone in doing so)...

  ...and the "Conscious Class" finally reaching the point where they've thrown up their hands and said "f**k it, I'm not giving them any more money".
• 

  Finkelstein

  The other thing worth considering is the actual costs involved in the operation of a printing branch which the WTS.

  had many. Such costs as electricity, food, medical and transportation costs etc. , costs of paper and ink for printing.

  All of these things have grown dramatically over the years, which has made it extremely difficult for an organization that acquirers its income from a donation basis to operate in financial balance. In that acknowledgement it becomes easy to understand why the WTS closed down some its printing branches around the world.

  This may have also brought forth the deciding influence to why they are now lessening its monthly printing production.
  
• 

  cognac

  Fink- Stop stating things as facts when you don't know the facts.

  Your "facts" are actually your opinions.

  So what your saying then Cognac is that the WTS postulating the we need more card is due to undisclosed law suits ?

  No, it's a culmination of things.

  All the consolidating the WTS has done in past few years has been to impending law suits ?

  
  

  Same answer as above.

  The other fact is that there are not if any law suits that have been levied against the WTS that hasn't made to the outside media or the inter-net.

  That's a fact? Once again, don't state something as a fact if it's not.
• 

  Doubting Bro

  I agree with Fink. The most obvious answer to their money problems is that they over extended on their infrastructure anticipating revenues were going to grow yet likely their revenues stayed flat or maybe even declined. If they declined, the reason is likely because members either 1) still show up like me but have purposely closed their wallets (probably a minority) or 2) simply can't afford to give as much or more than they used to because incomes have been stagnant and the average JW according to the Pew study makes less than pretty much any other religion. I really think #2 is hurting them the worse. When you tell people to simplify their lives to do more knocking on doors and to limit the amount of education they seek, you've hurt your revenue base. Growth in wealthier countries is much lower than in developing countries which means you have more people but less money per person. For example, if they thought when they got to 8 million members that each person would contribute an average of $10 per month (just using numbers for example, I have no idea what their model calls for), then you get 80 million per month. Yet, now they are at 8 million but people are only contributing $5 per month because the growth is coming form places where disposable income is less, then you are running at 40 million per month. That's a big hole to deal with. Maybe the numbers aren't that drastic but you get the idea.

  Lawsuits hurt obviously but they have money set aside for that and can budget that expense. It's the overall lack of revenues that is the lasting issue. And the GB has admitted they have more going out than coming in. So the solution is to sell assets, cut staff and hunker down while attempting to liquidate as much as you can (ie raiding the local congregations bank accounts for a one time bump).

  Oh and there's no way they will lose their tax exempt status in the US. Seriously, ITS NOT GOING TO HAPPEN. The only way would be if the IRS changed their criteria and while religion is waning it certainly is still very powerful and the backlash to removing the tax exempt status from any group would be fought by all. As much as I think NO religion should be exempt from taxes, that's what we are dealing with at least in the US.
• 

  Finkelstein

  OK lets assume a couple have occurred out of honest speculative probability, that's not the norm though.

  I'm not trying to say that the WTS has hundreds of millions sitting undisclosed in banks .

  What I am assuming is that the WTS got itself into some financial stress due its building projects.

  That stress will be subsequently relieved when more of its highest valued properties in Brooklyn are finally sold off.
  
• 

  cognac

  Fink - it's not just the building projects that gave them financial stress.

  One would think that it would be relieved through the selling of the Brooklyn properties. I am no longer of that opinion. But, no matter what is said in this thread, the only public proof of what is fact will be time...