Did you ever have a discussion with an apostate that helped your journey out.

by jwfacts 51 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Londo111
    Londo111

    In 1990, when visiting Bethel, a whole crowd of apostates were in front protesting, holding up signs about Jesus being their mediator too, ect… None of that helped, it frightened me. Then later I saw Mr. Coffee, which cemented into my head what apostates were.

    A person in my congregation in the late 90’s who I befriended said things that in retrospect were seeds to try to help me wake up. For instance, he mentioned about early JWs teaching that Jehovah lived around a star. I considered that hogwash.

    Later, I discovered he looked at both a video of Ray Franz and gay porn on my computer. Therefore, I with another friend decided to approach him first to report himself to the elders. Poor guy was shaking like a leaf. I don’t think we ever pursued matters to the point of reporting him. Needless to say, the little things he said didn’t help me think, because he didn’t really present documented proof.

    Over the years I accidently stumbled upon crazy looking websites with lots of ranting, like Danny Hazzard or Rick Fearon, and they came across exactly like the angry, bitter apostates Watchtower talked about. That didn’t help me.

    I remember a forum I accidently stumbled across with post from the “Liberal Elder”, and a post where a woman said she was a pioneer and just discovered 607 BC was wrong. I considered these places traps. I didn’t believe for a moment that the poster was a pioneer, but rather an apostate pretending to be one.

    Years later, when I first started to research 607 BC as a litmus test, looking for neutral sources, I did inevitably come across “apostate” sites, like this one or JWfacts. However, I basically assumed that I would have to weed through the lies, half-truths, and misrepresentations, with a kernel of truth here and there. However, over many months, I began to realize that sites like JWfacts were in fact 100% factual, whereas Watchtower were the ones being deceitful.

  • Crazyguy
    Crazyguy

    Reading other Christians opinions on bible subjects really got the ball rolling for me. When their ideas made more sense and could be backup by the Bible unlike the JWs that was the beginning of the end for me. Only came to sites like this place after I realized they stole the mediator from me and the other JWs.

  • Hairtrigger
    Hairtrigger

    I was always bored at the meetings and most ( 98 percent ) of the speakers pissed me off. They couldn't give a talk worth a damn. The hypocrisy of The dubs with their false smiles and unbiblical attitudes(preach something but do just the opposite) falsifying service time etc made me seriously doubt this was the truth. Then one day at a public talk the speaker was quoting " when under trial let no one say that they are being tried by god..." and then it clicked that the trial of Job was sponsored by the Hobogod. Contradiction. I went into Randys website and read Barbara Anderson. Then JW facts and this website. Got hold of CoC . By this time I told my wife I no longer believed in religion or the existence of a god given the empirical evidence that no such entity exists and she was pleased. She isn't a witness by the way. The rest was a fade and away from the cult. I wanted to write them and tell them to go fcuk themselves but my wife dissuaded me saying it didnt matter, wasn't needed. The fact that I had mentally severed myself from them was reason enough not to have anything further to do with them. She had a hard time for the seven years I was baptized. Said it had changed me and made me quite fanatical. I now know how true that was.

  • berrygerry
    berrygerry

    I recommend that cult-victim-rescuers read this webpage:

    http://www.jwfacts.com/watchtower/helping-someone-leave.php

    ;)

  • LongHairGal
    LongHairGal

    JWFACTS:

    I remember speaking on the phone to an ex-JW. This might have been around the year 2000 and before I started my "fade" and I was getting my ducks in a row and my facts together (if only for my own satisfaction).

    One thing he said that sticks out in my mind was that the religion always said "we should never trust our own judgment". His argument was: why then should we trust theirs??.. Good point.

    He also agreed with my observation that they were the height of arrogance.

  • Pete Zahut
    Pete Zahut

    It seems to me that the "rabid apostate" approach scares people off and even a JW's with serious doubts of his or her own, can be intimidated or shocked back into their safe little rut of cognitive dissonance , after an encounter with an apostate.

    To me the best way is to quietly raise questions, not demand answers or put them in a position of having to defend anything, and let them know where to go for answers or another point of view.

    It seems like a lot fo Apostate encounters with JW's are vindictive in nature and about the Apostate venting his or her frustrations rather than out of a true concern for enlightening anyone. I was far more inclined to look into the questions and doubts I had, on my own once I knew where to look.

  • stuckinarut2
    stuckinarut2

    As a "good witness" I would never give even the slightest credibility to anything said by one who had left the org, especially one who displayed the cliché "apostate" tendencies.

    The best result comes from a casually dropped, calmly spoken, BRIEF, sentence.....that encourages the mind to dwell on something.

    One lady who had left simply said a sentence to me once that was similar to the famous Aldous Huxley quote: "Facts do not cease to exist just because they are ignored"

    That stuck with me.....

  • sparrowdown
    sparrowdown

    Yes. I met an apostate in the D2D work she told me she was a witness and she no longer believed JWs "had the truth." Intrigued and feeling I needed to show compassion to this "arrogant" woman (lol) I listened to her. I asked her if she worried about armageddon and she said if some kind of armageddon came she would take her chances but refused to keep her life on hold for a religion and that I would do well to do the same.

    She said many other things and they stayed with me.

    Looking back I was already waking up at this point but I always felt great sympathy for apostates and ones that drifted away seeing for myself the great pain many were in when they left made me wonder why. I felt in my heart it was the religion and it's smallminded bigotry and harsh unattainable standards that broke many a spirit and caused them to leave in cruel circumstances.

    I think it was my own eyes, ears and conscience that woke me up but an old arsehole CO amd his first lady powerbitch wife helped seal the deal in the end, but I am grateful to that apostate lady for speaking her mind to me so courageously.

    So thankyou apostates, drifters, faders and "weak ones" who turned out to be the strong ones your struggle did not go unnoticed and it helped alot.

  • sparrowdown
    sparrowdown

    Oh and as far as so-called "aggressive" activists they made me curious I wondered what they so upset about.

    I always asked myself why? Why were they protesting "God's people" and I was not one to be satisfied with the standard JW vending machine answers like "they have turned their back on Jehovah" or "they must have done the wrong thing and now they're angry that they're disfellowshipped" those excuses didn't add up because I knew personally ones that had tried hard to stay faithful and wanted it to be the truth and make it work, so them just "being bad" didn't make sense.

  • LoisLane looking for Superman
    LoisLane looking for Superman

    I had a dear friend I grew up with, leave The Lie. He was third generation Bethelite. Like wow! How could he be so theocratic and leave? He left The Lie a few years after marrying. For decades I thought he must have gotten involved in swinging, you know, sex orgies and such. It never crossed my mind that he would have left because he found out his grandfather's religion was all a con, rules and doctrines dictated by narcissistic men, lording in over the flock.

    After I read CofC I looked up and found my old friends phone number and called. I said to him in all sincerity, ___, why didn't you tell me this religion was all fake? I don't think he said anything. I actually was in shock after not talking to him since 1969 at a convention. I think I said that if I had known it was all made up non sense, and he was the one that said it, and told me it was all garbage, I would have believed him, and it would have changed my whole life.

    What an unintended heavy responsibility I put on his shoulders. He had no responsibility to tell me, to give me the key to unlock the JW..org prison door so I could escape. I am sorry ___ if I sounded hurt. There is no turning the clock back, should of, could of, would of. No. All of us can only go forward with the knowledge we have available to each of us now.

    No. No apostate influenced me.

    Too many strutting their stuff Elders, said and did too many things to me when seperating from my abusive Elder husband. Pray more. Be a better wife. Go out in service more. Read your Bible more. The final cop out, leave it in Jehovah's hands and stay together. What???

    The most educated (of course, not a JDub) and highly respected man I knew had told me a few years before when I was trying to preach to him... Didn't I know about the cave drawings in France that are over 17,000 years old? Noooo. You should look it up. So I did. Oh oh. I had been trying to tell him about mankind being just over 6,000 years old... and about the creative days, (because that is what those GB high school idiots told me and being a good little zombie that learned through 5 meetings a week to parrot out, back, what was said to me... ) He, and many others, must have taken me for a bloomin' idiot too!

    I would still shy away from those ones who are shouting out or picketing at District Conventions. I don't listen to... religious fanatics anymore.

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