Cofty,
I am aware of your evolution posts but never had the time to properly go through them all. I think I will start at your first post and comment as I see fit.
truthseeker
Are you a Christian Who Accepts Evolution?
by cofty 85 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
-
-
truthseeker
Whatshallicallmyswlf,
thanks for reply. Adaptation can give an improvised outcome - survival of the fittest - this in itself is an improvement.
No malaria is not an improvement.
-
ilikecheese
I'm a Christian, and I accept evolution. I think the main point is that you just don't take the Old Testament creation story literally. I feel like most non-fundies assume God created the world through the process of evolution. He "guided" it, for lack of a better term. As an American, unfortunately, I think there are way too many of us who are hardcore creationists. I found a Pew Forum study on it from a few years ago...
http://www.pewforum.org/2013/12/30/publics-views-on-human-evolution/
That being said, I understand why people read The Bible and say, "What a bunch of nonsense!" It boggles my mind that people take it so literally. I don't think you can really use your brain and take it all as 100% accurate and not largely symbolic. People who take it literally and lord their religious superiority over others are really hard to deal with!
-
Saename
truthseeker - I believe man was already on this planet but as a Neanderthal
I don't have time nor any particular interest to clear out other misunderstandings you have about evolution (because there's just sooo much to talk about...), but I still wanted to clarify this one issue.
Neanderthals are not our ancestors.
Repeat: Neanderthals are not our ancestors.
They're our cousins. We evolved from Homo heidelbergensis, and Homo neanderthalensis evolved from Homo heidelbergensis as well, which makes us cousins.
-
jp1692
Saename: Neanderthals are not our ancestors.
What does it mean to be human (Smithsonian National Museum of Natural History):
"Neanderthals have contributed approximately 1-4% of the genomes of non-African modern humans, although a modern human who lived about 40,000 years ago has been found to have between 6-9% Neanderthal DNA (Fu et al 2015). The evidence we have of Neanderthal-modern human interbreeding sheds light on the expansion of modern humans out of Africa." - (Click the link above to read the full article)
-
Vidiot
To sum up jp1692's post, Neanderthals have contributed to the ancestry of people of European descent.
-
Vidiot
truthseeker - "Cofty, I am aware of your evolution posts but never had the time to properly go through them all..."
Very few of us have.
Like I told him in another recent post, he's essentially written a (very large) book by now.
Which - lets face it - is impressive.
How many people do that? On a fricking message board, no less?
-
Saename
jp1692 - "Neanderthals have contributed approximately 1-4% of the genomes of non-African modern humans, although a modern human who lived about 40,000 years ago has been found to have between 6-9% Neanderthal DNA (Fu et al 2015). The evidence we have of Neanderthal-modern human interbreeding sheds light on the expansion of modern humans out of Africa." - (Click the link above to read the full article)
I am fully aware of that. The problem is that you have no idea what you're reading.
Again, Homo sapiens did not evolve from Homo neanderthalensis. Homo sapiens evolved from Homo heidelbergensis. Once our species appeared and moved out of Africa, our ancestors started interbreeding with the neanderthals. All that means is that modern non-African humans have neanderthal DNA (they are descendants of the neanderthals.) As a species, however, we did not evolve from them. They are our cousins. Richard Dawkins said as much in his conversation with George Pell, but when he was explaining it, he was interrupted. Hence, he didn't get to explain it, but he did say that Homo neanderthalensis are not our ancestors (as a species):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZobzGgE5KE
If you don't trust me on this, trust an expert.
-
jp1692
Saename: The problem is that you have no idea what you're reading.
Well that's just fucking stupid!
You don't know me and you don't know anything about my background or expertise. If you did, you'd realize what a completely wrong-headed and misguided comment you just made.
I was agreeing with you, you twit, and posted that excerpt from the Smithsonian to support you. Seriously, get the clue!
Could it be your arrogance that blinded you?
I really hate it when self-righteous people on forums like this that can't tell the difference between those that agree with them and those these don't. You make an argument of everything.
Go reread my post and see that I said NOTHING to warrant your self-biased induced knee-jerk response based on what you ASSUMED I meant rather than what I actually wrote. I posted a factoid. What you "read into that" is a projection of your own biases and neuroses.
For an obviously EDUCATED person, your response to me was not smart, nuanced or kind. Hence this response in kind, of a different sort.
I sure as hell don't need you to school me in the science, but you obviously need some lessons in manners.
-
jhine
"on this forum we constantly see posters conflating evolution with atheism. This is an error that is worth pointing out."
l totally agree with that Cofty . ln my Church ( C of E ) l don't know anyone who does not accept evolution . We include a science teacher and a retired research chemist who is a lay reader . Can l also point out that higher education is encouraged and going to uni is seen as a VERY GOOD THING .
So many ex JWs seem to view all religion through WT coloured glasses and that is a shame .
Jan