Jesus Christ is still a human (page 2)

hooberus

I never said that He was "just" a man. I said that He was still a man. I also believe that He is and always has been God.

peacefulpete

But Just for fun....., "God is not a man that he should tell lies, or a son of man that he should repent" Numbers 23:19

And remember God is the same yesterday, today and tomorrow!

SpannerintheWorks

Hi, Hooberus.

Yes, I know you never stated that Jesus was "just" a man, but if you want to be pedantic, look at your own words,

I never said that He was "just" a man.

Past tense, eh?

And you haven't stated, except in retrospect, that you believe that Jesus is/was more than "just" a man.

OK, as you have brought up the subject, can you prove that Jesus is God?

Spanner

hooberus

Spanner said:

Yes, I know you never stated that Jesus was "just" a man, but if you want to be pedantic, look at your own words,
I never said that He was "just" a man.
Past tense, eh?

Look again at my complete sentence and you see that I referred to him in the present "still a man" Here is my quote: "I never said that He was "just" a man. I said that He was still a man. I also believe that He is and always has been God." Perhaps, I should have used the word "is" instead of "was" for correct grammer tense. However I did refer to him in the same paragraph in the present "still a man" sence.

And you haven't stated, except in retrospect, that you believe that Jesus is/was more than "just" a man.
OK, as you have brought up the subject, can you prove that Jesus is God?
Spanner

I have presented the full deity of Jesus Christ on many other posts. This thread is on the subject of the current humanity of Jesus Christ. Hense I wish to stick to this subject here.

hooberus

The phrase "being put to death in the flesh, but made alive in the spirit" from 1 Peter 3:18 does not mean that Christ was not raised in the flesh. Compare with Romans 8:8-9 where believers with their bodies of flesh are said to be "not in the flesh, but in the spirit"

"Because Christ also suffered for sins once, the righteous for the unrighteous, that he might bring us to God; being put to death in the flesh, but made alive in the spirit; in which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison," 1 Peter 3:18-19 ASV

"So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God. But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his. And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness." Romans 8:8-10

1 Peter 3;18 says that Christ was "made alive in the spirit." It does not say that he was made alive as "a spirit." Jesus denied being "a spirit" as the watchtower teaches:

Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have. And when he had thus spoken, he shewed them his hands and his feet." Luke 24:39-40

Navigator

Hooberus-You speak of bodies as if there were two, a spiritual body and a flesh body. There is only one body. That body was created in the image and likeness of God and is immortal. It is perfect in every way. The so called "flesh body" is merely our "concept of body". We built it ourselves. Because of our false beliefs, it will malfunction from time to time and will eventually age and die. Jesus was resurrected in his immortal body. However, he had perfect control over it. He could make it appear solid as a "flesh body" or walk through closed dooors as the occassion demanded. He must have been able to alter his appearence as neither the women at the tomb or the apostles walking on the road to Emaeus recognized him right away.

hooberus

The so called "flesh body" is merely our "concept of body". We built it ourselves. Because of our false beliefs, it will malfunction from time to time and will eventually age and die.

Navigator are you saying that our fleshly body is only an illusion and that we do not now really have a body of flesh?

hooberus

Isaiah said that God "will swallow up death in victory" He shortly thereafter talked about his dead body arising.

" He will swallow up death in victory; and the Lord GOD will wipe away tears from off all faces; and the rebuke of his people shall he take away from off all the earth: for the LORD hath spoken it." Isaiah 25:8

"Thy dead men shall live, together with my dead body shall they arise. Awake and sing, ye that dwell in dust: for thy dew is as the dew of herbs, and the earth shall cast out the dead." Isaiah 26:19

Paul also taught that the Christians' "mortal bodies" would be quickened (made alive). When the Christains mortal bodies are made immortal by resurrection then as Isaiah said death would be swallowed up in victory.

"But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you." Romans 8:11

"So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory." 1 Corinthians 15:54

The phrase "this mortal" clearly referrs to this mortal body. Paul in Romans 8:11 and 1 Corinthians 15:54 is talking about mortal bodies being made alive (not discarded, and not remaining in the grave). Paul taught the resurrection of the body. Paul hoped for the redemption of his body, not his body being discarded forever, but it (his body) being redeemed or transformed (Phil. 3:21).

"And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body." Romans 8:23

Summary: The resurrection discussed in 1 Corinthians 15 is the resurrection of the body that died, not a "recreation" as "spirit creatures" devoid of the body that died.

gumby

So you actually think that jesus is human of flesh and blood, which would mean he would eat, sleep, and poop, in heaven. He is surrounded by his spirit father, and spirit angels, yet he is human? Who cuts his hair? Does he wear clothes? What kind of clothes? How about shoes.....does he wear them too.? If so....why would he need shoe's in a spirit realm?

Why would god have it that his son is flesh while the rest of the bunch up there is spirit.....including those to be ressurected with christ? Jesus said those raised would be made like him.(actually paul said it) So how about those ressurected hoob......will they be human also, or spirit?

Gumby

hooberus

Why would god have it that his son is flesh while the rest of the bunch up there is spirit.....including those to be ressurected with christ?

The son is a man in fullfillment of Psalm 8:4-6. The rest in heaven such as angels are to be made subject to this man.

"What is man, that thou art mindful of him? and the son of man, that thou visitest him? For thou hast made him a little lower than the angels, and hast crowned him with glory and honour. Thou madest him to have dominion over the works of thy hands; thou hast put all things under his feet:" Psalm 8:4-6

"Which he wrought in Christ, when he raised him from the dead, and set him at his own right hand in the heavenly places, Far above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this world, but also in that which is to come: And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church," Ephesians 1:20-22

"Who is gone into heaven, and is on the right hand of God; angels and authorities and powers being made subject unto him." 1 Peter 3:22

Also Jesus must be a fleshly decendant of David in order to sit on Davids throne (see my early posts on this thread).

Jesus said those raised would be made like him.(actually paul said it) So how about those ressurected hoob......will they be human also, or spirit?

Those who are resurrected are resurrected humans. Paul hoped for the redemption of his body. In the resurrection the fleshly body is raised and is transformed into a glorified fleshly body.

"And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body." Romans 8:23

"Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself." Philippians 3:21

"Behold my hands and my feet, that it is I myself: handle me, and see; for a spirit hath not flesh and bones, as ye see me have. And when he had thus spoken, he shewed them his hands and his feet." Luke 24:39-40

Jesus' body is the same flesh and the same body that was nailed to the cross (it has the wounds from the nails). It is also a "glorious body" (Phillippians 3:21).

Jesus Christ is still a human

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