a closed mind, a requirement? (page 2)

greatteacher

I agree with logansrun, "It's all bullshit"

hooberus

Hooberus your statements are rhetoric until you define "basic essentials of the faith" and "revealed basic doctrine".

The basic essential of the faith expressed in Deuteronomy 13 is that Isrealites were only to have YHWH as their God.

The basic essential of the faith expressed in Galatians 1 is that Christians were to hold to the gospel of the grace of Christ.

Faraon

Hooverus,

The basic essential of the faith expressed in Deuteronomy 13 is that Isrealites were only to have YHWH as their God.
The basic essential of the faith expressed in Galatians 1 is that Christians were to hold to the gospel of the grace of Christ.

Let us examine the essentials of the faith expressed in Deuteronomy 13 and Galatians 1

Deuteronomy 13

6 If your very own brother, or your son or daughter, or the wife you love, or your closest friend secretly entices you, saying, "Let us go and worship other gods" (gods that neither you nor your fathers have known, 7 gods of the peoples around you, whether near or far, from one end of the land to the other), 8 do not yield to him or listen to him. Show him no pity. Do not spare him or shield him. 9 You must certainly put him to death. Your hand must be the first in putting him to death, and then the hands of all the people. 10 Stone him to death, because he tried to turn you away from the LORD your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery. 11 Then all Israel will hear and be afraid, and no one among you will do such an evil thing again. 12 If you hear it said about one of the towns the LORD your God is giving you to live in 13 that wicked men have arisen among you and have led the people of their town astray, saying, "Let us go and worship other gods" (gods you have not known), 14 then you must inquire, probe and investigate it thoroughly. And if it is true and it has been proved that this detestable thing has been done among you, 15 you must certainly put to the sword all who live in that town. Destroy it completely, both its people and its livestock. 16 Gather all the plunder of the town into the middle of the public square and completely burn the town and all its plunder as a whole burnt offering to the LORD your God. It is to remain a ruin forever, never to be rebuilt. 17 None of those condemned things [2] shall be found in your hands, so that the LORD will turn from his fierce anger; he will show you mercy, have compassion on you, and increase your numbers, as he promised on oath to your forefathers, 18 because you obey the LORD your God, keeping all his commands that I am giving you today and doing what is right in his eyes.

In other words:

Kill any one, even close relatives, who has a different religious opinion. Do not listen to him. He is an apostate.

Do this because I am unable to investigate it myself or kill them myself.

You must be my eyes, ears, and murdering agents.

Galatians 1
6 I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting the one who called you by the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel?7 which is really no gospel at all. Evidently some people are throwing you into confusion and are trying to pervert the gospel of Christ. 8 But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be eternally condemned! 9As we have already said, so now I say again: If anybody is preaching to you a gospel other than what you accepted, let him be eternally condemned!

In other words:

You cannot change your mind. If you became an apostate, and change your mind, by the grace of Christ, who has a bigger stick, You will be in hell forever. That means longer than if a bird came from heaven and took a drop of water every million years, you will still burn in hell after the Earth has no more water. All of this by the grace of Loving Jesus!

??

The Jehovah?s Witnesses god, the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society, on the other hand, will only bring apostates an emotional and psychological death because they are unable to act as agents of Satan (UN, USA, England) will prevent them from killing apostates.

Faraon

Sorry, It should've read

The Jehovah?s Witnesses god, the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society, on the other hand, will only bring apostates an emotional and psychological death because they are unable to act, as [or due to the fact that] agents of Satan (UN, USA, England) will prevent them from killing apostates.

gumby

Faraon,

Well done!

Deuteronomy 13 and Galatians 1 do not tell Jews and Christians to not listen to different messengers but to listen carefully and then to discern the message against already revealed basic doctrine.

Revealed how?

Do you mean that people should believe what a person said was revealed to them? If Paul, or Peter, or John said something was revealed to him.....I should believe him?

Why should I believe Peter or John, or anybody else who has said we have to believe jesus came and died for us, and we must believe that or die? Galations reads we must not believe every inspired expression........only the one you are REQUIRED to believe in......or die.

Gumby

Faraon

Gumby,

Revealed how?

Do you mean that people should believe what a person said was revealed to them? If Paul, or Peter, or John said something was revealed to him.....I should believe him?

Why should I believe Peter or John, or anybody else who has said we have to believe jesus came and died for us, and we must believe that or die? Galations reads we must not believe every inspired expression........only the one you are REQUIRED to believe in......or die.

Agree, but also note the silliness of the following quote from Galatians 1:8:

But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach a gospel other than the one we preached to you?

Never mind that it is an angel (messenger) from heaven brings changes, just like the NT writers brought to you in order to change the OT. You must not listen to it (angels have no gender).

As a matter of fact, Gal. 1:8 claims that even if they change their mind (I supposed it means early church leaders), change their mind, they should be not listened to.

If we apply this text to JW doctrine, there should be NO NEW LIGHT, as they should not be listened to because it is a different teaching than their original one.

In the time of Jesus and the apostles, the most read version, even in Judea, of the Babble was the Septuagint. As you know this was so inspired that all the 70 translators ;) had exactly the same translation word for word. Nowadays this version is not used by anyone except the Catholics. When Paul said that all scripture is inspired, blah, blah, blah, he was talking about the Septuagint and not the NT.

The GB makes decisions based on two thirds of the vote. This means that, at least in some decisions, part of their executives were not inspired by the Holey Spook. Yet, they insinuate that their god sent its decisions, and they let everyone else know.

The same thing happened in the OT and the NT. Majority of votes or decisions are enforced by the most powerful or majority of votes. Many of the gospels in existence at the time came into oblivion.

gumby

Never mind that it is an angel (messenger) from heaven brings changes, just like the NT writers brought to you in order to change the OT. You must not listen to it (angels have no gender).

Yes sir e bob,

I thought Angels were supposed to be listened to.....like John who spoke of such in the beggining of Revelations. An Angel delivered the message to John, which message came from Jesus, who got it from God, yet paul say's not to listen to one if it spoke, and listen to what men say is true about Jesus?

Gumby

Faraon

I thought Angels were supposed to be listened to.....like John who spoke of such in the beggining of Revelations. An Angel delivered the message to John, which message came from Jesus, who got it from God, yet paul say's not to listen to one if it spoke, and listen to what men say is true about Jesus?

Especially since Revelation, supposedly being the last book in the Babble, was written after Paul's warning, the message should be ignored.

A Paduan

A requirement for being accessory to your own hoodwinking

There is a difference between an "opinion" (what one thinks) and "God's spell" - especially when they're different.

Oracroth

It's ironic how much JW influences everyone. On the outside of the religeon and it seems everyone still can't help but look in. I don't beleive anything anymore. If I'm imperfect then no matter what I do I'm going to get it wrong. Even that fact that I don't feel like striving for inevitability is wrong biblically. Therefore I cast off my flesh and accept that I am nothing more than dust attempting to alter the coarse of other dust on this dust filled rock we call a planet trying to prove that I'm more than dust. Eventually I will die and become dust once again so other dust can feed on the dust that sprouts from me. That is all life is.

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"I have lived countless Eons only to find that I would trade it all for a chance never to have lived."

a closed mind, a requirement?

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