Two witness rule: Stop using it, its not working on JWs!

by StephaneLaliberte 61 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  Island Man

  I have stated before that the 2-witness rule is irrelevant to the issue of JWs hiding incidents of pedophilia because even when there are two witnesses they still don't report incidents to the police as a matter of policy, worldwide. And even if they don't have 2 witnesses to the incident, that has no bearing on reporting a serious criminal allegation to the police since the 2 witness rule only applies to internal congregational discipline.

  The real issue is the organization's selfish, egotistical drive to avoid negative allegations about members becoming public knowledge and bringing reproach on the organization. They're willing to risk the safety of children to preserve their self-assumed, white-washed image. That is the real issue - not the 2 witness rule.
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  StephaneLaliberte

  AbusedandPissed: The concept of the "clergy-penitent" privilege is maintained in specific circumstances that are often not met with the JWs. See this article: https://www.revealnews.org/blog/jehovahs-fight-law-requiring-child-sex-abuse-be-reported-to-police/

  In most cases, the elders will investigate with the victim and the parents. Then, sometimes, will even dis-fellowship the pedophile! And still, they won't report to the police. That scenario is not protected by any clergy-penitent privilege. Not when a minor is involved. In fact, it is mandatory in many states/countries to report such abuse!

  Despite the legalities of things, it is not because something is legal that it is moral. Even if the JWs find some way to wiggle themselves through the local laws, on moral grounds, they fall short of what you'd expect from the true religion.
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  AbusedandPissed

  yes did you read that the judge says that the privilege can extend to JWs but not in that specific case? Again other courts have found the same thing. It is a complex thing and you make it sound so simple.
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  StephaneLaliberte

  I beg to differ: it is actually simple and JWs make it complicated in order to dodge their moral obligations.
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  truthlover123

  So Jesus goes to Warwick... Meets with the GB and says "Let all the children come to me" - What do you think would happen? How many thousands of children would turn them in? FInd the GB bloodguilty - they have treated these children with contempt and most of all, the kids have lost the trust the society instilled in them at an early age - groomed to LOVE our brothers and sisters ....so to speak... by not hearing of their plight and the GB wanting to hid their money that they are sucking out of the pubs when the perp is found guilty in a court of law- these children are as lost souls due to the GB ignorance and GREED..and lie when it gets too hot, as Geoff Jackson did in Australia at the ARC where 1,006 perps were uncovered who were never reported to police and probably abused more than one child--that leads to several thousand abuses in Australia alone.. ole Jackies home land.

  They have abused and discredited the God of the Scriptures-- blackened His name and hid behind one scripture that was used for adult crimes....who really wants to do door to door anymore???or attend meetings?? Memorial numbers down in hall this year.....

  Clergy-pentitant prov is being rescinded in some states- hopefully more will follow
  
  
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  Vidiot

  Island Man - "...The real issue is the organization's selfish, egotistical drive to avoid negative allegations about members becoming public knowledge and bringing reproach on the organization..."

  It goes further.

  The more widely known the truth becomes (especially amongst the R&F), the smaller the pool of "qualified brothers" needed to run the individual congregations becomes (and they're already experiencing a shortage of those willing to "reach out"), because those guys become ineligible for duties.

  Remember, after Barb Anderson appeared on 60 Minutes, the Org put out a statement that any member who'd sinned in that manner was no longer eligible to serve in a congregation capacity...

  ...but a few years later, they ever-so-quietly reversed that decision, if the incident were not commonly known (like I said, they've been experiencing a shortage).

  A lot of us tend to forget that historically, decentralized high-control groups like the WTS have a much more difficult time maintaining themselves (and thusly surviving) if they can't function at the grassroots level.

  Why else do you think they're transitioning to trolly and park table work? It (among other things) is an attempt to mitigate any potential accusations that "sex offenders are knocking on your doors trying to recruit your kids".
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  _Morpheus

  Why else do you think they're transitioning to trolly and park table work? It (among other things) is an attempt to mitigate any potential accusations that "sex offenders are knocking on your doors trying to recruit your kids".

  Interesting thought, but it dosent add up. The door to door slavery is still in full effect and the only “exemplarily ” can do the carts. That means pedos are excluded from carts but still expected to go door to door....
  
  
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  StephaneLaliberte

  _Morpheus: only “exemplarily ” can do the carts. That means pedos are excluded from carts but still expected to go door to door....

  Considering that pedophiles who got caught several years ago and have not been caugth ever since can become an elder, I would expect these guys to be able to attend the carts.
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  Brokeback Watchtower

  Why else do you think they're transitioning to trolly and park table work? It (among other things) is an attempt to mitigate any potential accusations that "sex offenders are knocking on your doors trying to recruit your kids".

  I think you are right. If they are sending a known pedophile but according to their 2 witness rule/malarkey unknown to the public to people's doors opens them up for some serious lawsuits $$$. If a pedophile worms his way into a household and molests a child and it is done in the door to door work.

  Cart work on the other hand leaves them less likely vulnerable to lawsuits if they instruct the person simply stand there and not engage in extencive conversation and simply direct them to the Organization.
  
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  Brokeback Watchtower

  Cart work is a signal that the door to door is being phased out due to so much bad publicity over to 2 JW witness rule over the internet world wide.

  The WT corporation is now coming to the conclusion that future growth in membership is now in a downward spiral so limit lawsuit possibilities by directing its members to other activities to keep them busy with corporation directives and profit$$.

  Their holding firmly to the 2 witness rule while at present seems to be untenable due too greater public awareness and the shear volume of lawsuits this has caused. It will be very interesting to see how longs this bunch of delusional clowns called the Governing Body hold out on this very pathetic scriptural excuse for not reporting pedophiles to authorities and endangering the publics welfare. Judging from their past I would say that once they are about to go under financially that is when they will change and then it will be too late. So lawyers get ready for a legal feast day on the WTB&TS, he who hesitates risks millions.

  I think a running balance of WT's assets including KHs should be available to the courts and a on going investigation into its asset for the courts to decide damages should be made available in the future. Which may mean excepting a gage order and settling quickly to get their commission before funds run out.