by Aimee.Padilla 25 Replies latest jw experiences
Beautiful Anna.
I am one of those women who had to end up in an elder's meeting because I insisted on going to college.
They put a lot of pressure on me and took away my "pioneering privilege"
All these years later I realize what a gift their action was!
We are or were all victims of a manipulating and controlling cult ,
Controlling all aspects of our lives women regarding head covering and teaching at the k/hall etc usually did a better job than the bro's .
Controlling men having beards , wrong colour shirt , being pressured to reach out if they didn't they weren't spiritual.
Now free of the cult all people are equal.
at least in my case, made me open my eyes.
Many times it just takes one intense emotional experience to jar us to reality.
best 1st post I've ever read,
Welcome to the board
Men today in general like the ancient Hebrew social arrangement of what existed by that ancient civilization because it establishes their own power and control over woman, same is true today in many religions.
Ooohh that power is good ain't though.
In many ancient civilizations woman were mostly bought and paid for chattel, for example in Israel/Judea a man could buy a unwed woman who he raped from the woman's father, she didn't have a thing to say about it.
I did my pioneer service in a small rural congregation that had only one brother, who was the Presiding Minister.....this was back in 1960.
Since I had a one hour talk he needed me desperately to 'pay back' other congregations in the circuit who had provided their 'male only' speakers for the Sunday public talk. It wasn't as if I was special or very good at what was asked of me it was my achievement of being a male.
Looking back this was feminine racism which was practiced by any number of religions at the time and is still practiced within the religious community.
So we were the only two brothers in this small congregation. There was no other brother willing to serve. The rest were women and children. By default I became the assistant presiding minister .......... the Kingdom Hall School servant ........ the book room servant all at the age of 19. If we could have appointed sisters to these positions we would have been in better shape.
I soon became keenly aware that a number of these sisters were highly proficient in the door to door service. Two were special pioneers (150 service hours per month) and a couple of others were regular 100 hour per month pioneers. All were dedicated to going out in field service and conducting bible studies.
I became the field service servant. It became very understandable to me that if there was going to be an increase in attendance....... it was going to be caused by these sisters. As it was throughout the congregations world wise in that era and in that matter it sill is.
With rare exception the men were pretty much worthless in getting bible studies. They were too busy working to put food on the table and pay the bills. Their door to door service probably caused more harm then good.
Thinking back we had a cadre of highly qualified sisters who couldn't be used in any position of authority. What a waste of a resource that was. What a waste of a gift.
With rare exception the men were pretty much worthless in getting bible studies.
Thinking back we had a cadre of highly qualified sisters who couldn't be used in any position of authority. What a waste of a resource that was. What a waste of a gift.
I understand the complaint women in the JW organization have/had but in this case and isn't it good that men were "worthless" at getting Bible studies and isn't it a good thing that women were spared from having further culpability in the running and organization of a cult like false religion and misleading other vulnerable people? I don't understand why one would come to the conclusion that they were in a Cult and then complain that the cult leaders didn't allow them to have more authority in it.
I don't think anyone was intentionally "oppressed" from being a JW. Mislead, yes but the missed opportunities and wasted talents that both men and women experienced came from listening to men who (usually) had the best of intent when trying to apply ancient Middle East values in a modern western world. No one held a gun to our heads. A lot of young JW's had the courage early on, to do what they had to do to free themselves regardless of the consequences.
There is real oppression that took place in history and is still going on in the world but not many JW's today in the western world can (in my opinion) truly say they were "oppressed". Much of what we experienced, we allowed to happen because it was easier than having to face reality and make a big change. There was a personal payoff we enjoyed by staying as long as we did.
I am mystified and disheartened that there are negative reactions to this true and beautiful piece.
There was a retired attorney who used to participate here. Some of you may remember her. She was a big fan of the Beatles.
One day she asked the men here in all seriousness, "How have you adjusted to no longer being a dictator in your home?"
I don't think she meant it badly. For whatever reason, she bought into a very warped view of what it is like to be a male in the JW faith.
Similarly, I don't think the OP meant the things she said badly. Perhaps Mr. Duigenan's translation leaves something to be desired. Perhaps some of the things Ms. Padilla said that on the surface, appear to be patently false are actually true in her country.
Regardless, a celebration of the strong women who have left this miserable little cult needn't turn into a diatribe against men.
Pete I'm tired of your bull shit on this subject. There would be no Society if women didn't rise to the needs. They are not at fault.....the Society is.
What your now trying to promote sounds like an anti wives put down. Sorry if you lost your wife and children. But being an ass wipe on this forum is not the solution.
You used to be one of our best and kindest respondents on this slowly dissolving forum.
If you are having former wife issues how about shutting the F up and growing a pair.
This forum has to be a highway for those who are exiting the JW world not some horse shit about the women who thought it was the truth and wanted to help others.
You know what.. it's better to wait to post until you have sobered up.
Pete Zahut
I don't think anyone was intentionally "oppressed" from being a JW. Mislead, yes but the missed opportunities and wasted talents that both men and women experienced came from listening to men who (usually) had the best of intent when trying to apply ancient Middle East values in a modern western world. No one held a gun to our heads. A lot of young JW's had the courage early on, to do what they had to do to free themselves regardless of the consequences.
There is real oppression that took place in history and is still going on in the world but not many JW's today in the western world can (in my opinion) truly say they were "oppressed". Much of what we experienced, we allowed to happen because it was easier than having to face reality and make a big change. There was a personal payoff we enjoyed by staying as long as we did.
Your observations are dead on center Mr P-Zahut
I was a JW and things were great for me. No one oppressed me, most elders were very kind and nice to me. Some were ass holes but isn't that the case everywhere else. There are good and bad in all organizations.
I had lots of good friends that helped me when I needed help. The door was always open for me to leave the organization, no one kept me in prison like some kind of slave like Spartacus.
When I found out about 607 not being the real date. I had a choice. I did research, and decided that going to all those meetings, field service, and conventions was a lot of hard work for something that was not actually true. Once I found out after a couple of years of research that there was not going to be a paradise earth, I didn't think it was worth it to stay in anymore. I just stop going without an explanation. I didn't think it was necessary to give anyone an explanation and make a big stink about it. I also didn't cry because I was leaving several friends.
I find it kind of strange that some who leave the JWs get severely depress because of losing all their jw friends. Isn't there almost 8 billions souls out there that might possibly be your friend?
I am sure others have bad experiences with the JWs. Perhaps some were abused as children, perhaps others lost someone they loved to the blood transfusion doctrine, perhaps some lost out on a good career and struggled and got old and poor.
I don't think it's so much the JWs that are to blame, but instead we need to realize that this is the world we were born into. A person doesn't get an Owner's manual or set of instructions when he/she is born. And if your parents don't have any idea on what's going on, guess what, then neither will you!
The Universe doesn't care about us. We deal with the cards we are dealt and play the game the best we can and don't blame anyone for our misfortune.
I will quote something that put me in the right perspective.
During the minute it takes me to compose this sentence, thousands of animals are being eaten alive, others are running for their lives, whimpering with fear, others are being slowly devoured from within by rasping parasites; thousands of all kinds are dying of starvation, thirst and disease.
We were born in a world of blind physical forces, It does not matter who or what gets hurt. Some people are going to get hurt and some people are going to get "Lucky". No person on the planet will find any rhyme or reason in the justice and injustice that some of us will suffer, and nature is not interesting one way or another if we suffer every single day of our life, or if we become one of the world's billionaires and have more happiness than 99.9% of the people on the planet.
So you do the best to survive. And if you are lucky and obtain a little wisdom, you just might make it to 90. In the meantime roll with the punches. Enjoy love, enjoy good food, buy as many nice things as you are able to afford and enjoy. Try to stay as healthy as possible. Find some good friends of the opposite sex that you can talk to about anything and can count on as a close friend. Avoid people who bring you down. You have 8 billion humans to choose from.
I wonder how these women in the OP would feel if they were born in Saudi Arabia where women are totally controlled in every aspect of their life, from the time they come out of the womb, to the day they die, by some "Real" dominating bad men.
What if some of these women were able to escape their situation in Saudi Arabia when they were 50 years of age and the JWs were the ones who were there for them when they escaped. Helping them set up a home, lots of friends, food,etc
I wonder if the JWs would be as bad in their eyes as described by the OP?
Pete I'm tired of your bull shit on this subject. There would be no Society if women didn't rise to the needs. They are not at fault.....the Society is.I suppose the only thing you can do about that is choose not read my comments. If you do happen to read them, try and see through the negative filters you may have on this topic and try to see what the real intent of my post instead of projecting your own negative notions onto my words. Who said anything about anyone being at fault? If you read my comment again you'll realize that I was saying that we all have responsibility for the choices we make and the responsibility to change our former choices once we realized they were wrong. Many a JW did so and faced the consequences, but most stuck with their old choices because it was easier than the alternative and it was easier to let others take charge of our lives or blame someone else than to face up to what we needed to do. My original post was to demonstrate that anyone can find someone to blame for what happened to them....even men. We were victims too. Like fools we spend hours giving and preparing talks, sitting in elders meetings, being examples being watched by everyone especially those looking to find fault, only to find out it was all a hoax. Men don't get to blame anyone for this, we don't get to refer to ourselves as "warriors" once we got the courage to leave.
How did you ever come up with such a notion, and why all the crude language ?? Can't you not find a way to articulate your thoughts and feelings without resorting to crude and childish name calling?? As it happens I have a wonderful wife and she and my sons left the organization along with me. Thankfully she is not one to blame men or anyone else for the years she wasted as an intelligent woman in the JW organization and the things she was subjected to as well as the opportunities she missed. She realizes that she wasn't forced to do any of it. She liked the fact that men took charge. She didn't have to shoulder any of the responsibility nor any blame. She had 2 sisters who had the courage to leave once they became of age but she blindly trusted what she heard from the platform and choose to stick with it even though it didn't make sense. She freely admits that she did so simply because it was familiar and it was easy to go along with the status quo rather than risk being shunned like her sisters. She knows that there are people in this world who lived and are living under real oppression and she wasn't one of them She blames no one (including herself) that's why she was able to move on and why she isn't filled with resentment and anger.
What your now trying to promote sounds like an anti wives put down. Sorry if you lost your wife and children. But being an ass wipe on this forum is not the solution.
You used to be one of our best and kindest respondents on this slowly dissolving forum.
If you are having former wife issues how about shutting the F up and growing a pair.
Well thanks I guess, for your initial compliment but what makes you think I've changed? More importantly, who do you think you are telling me I can't express my opinion as I see fit?
Grow a pair are you serious ?? It seems to me you might do well to heed your own advice and grow up as well. You might also try to figure out where all this apparent hostility and narcissism is coming from. Try and figure out why you'd become so rattled by a few sentences written by a complete stranger on a page in a public forum, that weren't even directed at you.
This forum has to be a highway for those who are exiting the JW world not some horse shit about the women who thought it was the truth and wanted to help others.
You know what.. it's better to wait to post until you have sobered up.
I have no idea what you were saying in your first sentence, but the last sentence gives me a clue as to what's going on with you today and you're assuming everyone else is in the same condition.
You needn't tell me the purpose of this forum. I'm well aware of its purpose and I'm quite sure it doesn't exist so that you can go on a foul mouth tirade and tell others what they can and cannot say, whenever you disagree with them.
