JUST WHEN ARE THE LAST DAYS SUPPOSE TO BE???

by JT 20 Replies latest jw friends

  • JT
    JT

    someone EMAILED ME who lurks and asked if i could repost this thread from my archives-

    she has issues with the Bible and how it is always giving folks hope, yet never delivers- she wanted to know Why has the last days been going on since- the bible was written-???

    i'm just doing the lady a favor- i told her what i thought of the following repost

    repost!!!!!!!!!!!

    The Last Days in the 14 th Century

    All through recorded history there have been people who have pointed to the calamities, horrors and disasters in the world, and preached that this signified an imminent end of the world. This is not even unique to Christianity, which started off with strong millennial expectations in the 1 st century, and for the most part retains the same expectations almost 2000 years later.

  • JT
    JT

    The Last Days in the 14 th Century

    All through recorded history there have been people who have pointed to the calamities, horrors and disasters in the world, and preached that this signified an imminent end of the world. This is not even unique to Christianity, which started off with strong millennial expectations in the 1st century, and for the most part retains the same expectations almost 2000 years later.

    Many Christians through the centuries, always convinced that their time was that of the end, has always pointed to the ones who doubted the messages of doom and gloom, and applied to them the worlds in 2. Peter about "scoffers." Of course, the "scoffers" have always been correct, and the doomsayers were always wrong.

    Assuming we accept the troubled interpretation of the so-called synoptic apocalypse that has Jesus stating that wars, diseases, famine, crime and earthquakes would be a sign of his future second coming, let us put a loyal Christian at the end of the 14th century.

    He has witnessed and experienced the events of this century, and looked for the "signs" of Jesus coming. What would he find?

    Wars

    The descendents of Genghis Khans Mongol hordes killed c. 35 000 000 of Chinese peasantry from 1311 to 1340. Mongol hordes had annihilated whole civilizations from the Pacific to the Adriatic Sea in the previous century; the wars that followed in China when these rulers were fought off were no less destructive.

    Do not believe for a second that this is even remotely all. In 1337 the longest war in recorded history, the Hundred Years War between England and France, started. The whole of Europe was also, through the first half of this century, divided into countless regional conflicts and feuds.

    Asia was not through with genocidal war, alas.

    Along, in 1370, came a Turkic conqueror known as Timur Lenk (or Tamerlane). He was a Tatar, a Muslim of Mongol descent. Timur Lenk wasnt second to even Genghis Khan in cruelty and ambitions for world dominance; his hordes slaughtered entire cities and left nations completely devastated. Timur Lenk typically built towers on the site of devastated cities with the skulls of the slaughtered population.

    Even great cities like Bagdad and Damascus were plundered and their populations annihilated. In India, it is estimated that one million people were killed in a few weeks alone. The century ended at the closing of this savage destruction; Timur Lenk died in 1405 during a campaign against China.

    Pestilence

    The Black Death (probably bubonic and pneumonic plague) killed at least 75 000 000 people in Eurasia alone from 1347 to 1351. This is the worst pestilence ever in sheer numbers, but neither its mortality nor its global nature was unique.

    Around 1/3rd of Europe?s population perished; that is 25 000 000 people. In 1400, the population in England was perhaps half of what it had been 100 years earlier. In recorded history, the Black Death stands as a unique watershed, cutting off all continuity and paving the way for a whole new division of power and a changed order of things.

    Along with the famines that ravished the world in this century came countless other outbreaks of pestilence and disease. Dysentery and anthrax, and many other diseases, caused untold suffering. Also, leprosy reached its highest scope in Europe ever in this century.

    Earthquakes

    Contemporary chronicles of the 14th century reports a large number of highly destructive earthquakes. Accompanied by the other calamities in this time wars, famine, pestilence these were highly devastating.

    A horrible Earthquake in 1348 for which no reliable fatality estimates exists, devastated greater parts of Europe. In Hungary, 36 towns or castles were destroyed, and some people even believe that the Black Death that followed was caused by all the corpses lying around after this disaster.

    Likewise, in 1356 the Swiss city Basel was totally demolished by an earthquake.

    In China, the period from 1337 to 1345 were marked by a large number of destructive earthquakes.

    Milnes catalogue of historical earthquakes lists 143 destructive earthquakes for the 14th century. Considering the errant recording, its safe to say that this is a very low figure.

    Crime

    Following great disasters are always those who prey on the victims. Criminologist who have studied crime during the ages will note that sharp increases in crime has often followed disasters, like plagues and wars.

    The 14th century was one in which crime was on a steep increase. Historian George Lucas reports of a "great increase in crime." At the same time, piracy at the great seas was on the increase.

    Violent crime was so prevalent that it may have contributed to the population decline at the end of this century. The general fear, materialism and cynicism caused by the Black Plague was no doubt a great contribution to dissolution of public moral and law and order.

    Famine

    The 14th century marks the start of some serious climatic changes that caused widespread disturbances in seasons and crops. The result was widespread storms, rain, flood, droughts and of course serious crop failures. The worst, but by far the only one, was the universal famine 1315-1317, which caused conditions almost too cruel to mention.

    It is reported through contemporary chroniclers that parents ate their children, that people dug up bodies from churchyards for food, and that it even was common for people to kill others for food. In Europe north of the Alps and the Pyrenees 10% of the population perished according to some estimates.

    Right before the Black Death another serious famine devastated nations; it is estimated it may have affected 1/5th of mankind.

    Conclusion

    Any Christian at the end of the 14th century, having the same confused and a-historical understanding of "end-time signs" as contemporary doomsayers like Hal Lindsay or the Jehovah?s Witnesses, could not fail to be convinced that the end of the world was imminent in 1400. The calamities he had experienced, if he had survived through the greater part of this century (a rare occurrence indeed), simply had to be a fulfillment of Jesus' prophecy.

    And yet, here we are, 600 years later, and we can listen to doomsayers who are ignorant about the events of the past spreading propaganda that would have us believe that our century is particularly bad.

    Nobody with any regard for facts can seriously argue that the 20th century even comes close to being "worse" than the 14th century. On the contrary, the population boom has occurred precisely because the causes of an early death that plagued that century have been brought under control. These calamities still exist and cause suffering, but their fatality and scope is only a fraction compared to earlier ages.

    Remember: In 1300 there may have been around 450 million people in the world. One hundred years later there were considerably less. In 1900, there were around 1 600 million people. We left the 20th century with almost four times as many people as entered it; over 6 000 million. That is a unique testimony to a century of prosperity beyond what our ancestors could imagine.

    - Jan

  • nilfun
    nilfun

    That's definitely one I'm going to print out! Thanks for reposting this, JT.

  • Gopher
    Gopher

    I'm sure glad mankind survived the 14th century !!

    Interesting point, this:

    here we are, 600 years later, and we can listen to doomsayers who are ignorant about the events of the past spreading propaganda that would have us believe that our century is particularly bad.

    Just like the old saying goes, those who ignore history are "doomed" to repeat it. Those who are convinced that the 20th or 21st century are the last days can benefit by paying attention to history.

    It is not merely empty-headed scoffing at prophecy that prompts these thoughts, but rather an open-minded view at how bad things have been before and the progress mankind has made in various areas since then. True we don't have a perfect world now, but who would have traded life now for life in the 14th century?

  • fran
    fran

    THE LAST DAYS.

    The present Gospel age in which we live is spoken of in the scriptures as the LAST DAYS.In hebrews 1:2 we read that god "hath in these LAST DAYS spoken unto us by his Son.Acts 2:17 "It shall come to pass in THE LAST DAYS,saith god,i will pour out my Spirit upon all flesh.

    2TIM 3:1 Jas 5:3,2nd Peter 3:3

    THE LAST TRUMP ,THE DAY OF JUDGMENT ,THE DAY OF THE LORD,all the same..........ONE DAY.

    THE REIGN OF CHRIST,on the day of Pentecost.Peter declared (Acts 2:34-36)that the ressurection and ascension of Jesus christ was in fullfillment of Psalm 110.2nd verse declares that Christ would reign in the midst of His enemies.also 1st Cor 15:24,then cometh the end,when He shall have delivered up the Kingdom to God,even the Father;

    Jesus christ is reigning today in the midst of His enemies.His reign reaches its terminus at the ressurection of the saints,death is then destroyed.=the last enemy.

    Collossians 1:13 says that God hath delivered us from the power of darkness,and hath translated us into the Kingdom of His dear son"So we are at present in the Kingdom of the Son and He shall deliver up the Kingdom to god the father,that God may be all in all.1st Cor 15;2428.

    Jesus christ began his reign as King when he broke the power of death at the ressurection.

    (ask JWS who sits at the right hand of God is it a man,an archangel,a spirit,Jesus?)since they say that Jesus of Nazereth is dead,His body dissolved into gasses.......so who is the seed of david and does he still exist.?what MAN is going to judge the world.?Acts 17:31.

    Hebrews 10-12 says After he had offered himself as one sacrifice for sins for ever THE MAN Jesus sat down at Gods right hand.how could this be if He was disposed of?WT says that no-one knows where the body of Jesus is.

    ask JWS for one NT scripture that clearly says that christ is coming back to set up His Kingdom and reign on earth.

    Papias founded his doctrine upon the wishful hopes of Judaism,they wanted the Messiah to reconstitute the Jewish nation with earthly dominion and glory this did not happen so the judaisers of the early church set it down for fullfillment at his second coming.the idea of a millenial reign on earth proceeded from judaism,for among the jews the representation was growing,that the Messiah would reign for a thousand years upon the earth,such products of Jewish imagination passed over into Christianity "(Neanders,History of Christian dogmas,!Vol 1 page 248.

    The Apostle paul uttered a warning against this very thing when he wrote to Titus,"Not giving heed to Jewish fables"Titus 1:14.

    Today we have so much confusion,

    The Lord coming will be largely unanticipated by the world.

    Mark 13:35-36.Math 24:44,Math 25:13,Luke21:35 1st Thss 5;2-42nd Peter 3;10,Rev 16;15.

    the coming of the Lord is likened to unto lightening flashing in a brief moment from one part of the sky to another part-sudden-swift-dazzling."For as the lightening cometh out of the esat and shineth even unto the west;so shall also the coming of the Son of man be"Math 24;27;Luke 17:24.

    the coming of the Lord will be so swift,that it likened to the brief moment,or one might say"split second"occupied bt the twinkling of an eye.

    taken from ;THE SECOND ADVENT AND RELATED EVENTS by W.F.Mullan.copies of this message write to Box2332,Sudbury,Ontario.P3E 4N5

  • Dansk
    Dansk

    The last days are when each of us are on our own deathbed!

    Dansk

  • seedy3
    seedy3

    Many have been predicting the "End" for centuries, but during the Christian era it has been especially popular, check out this website.

    http://www.sullivan-county.com/nf0/y2k/bible_ca.htm

  • Carmel
    Carmel

    IMHO the biblical "last days" are the same as similar references in other religious text. They all refer to the decline of a way of life, religious influence or world cosmology. The "end time" are like the labor pains that preceed a new born and I personally think we are seeing the destruction of many old ways, politically, and religously. The trick for us is to recognize what is on the ascent and what is on the decent.

    carmel

  • JT
    JT
    That's definitely one I'm going to print out! Thanks for reposting this, JT.

    no problem - it is information like this that for those who use critical thinking are prone to ASK the forbidden questions and be willing to accept the answers- i realize that believers want to believe and desire to believe that THEY ARE LIVING IN THE LAST DAYS but as the questioned asked WHICH GENERATION OF BELIEVERS DIDN'T THINK that they were the ONE- AND YET no one ever stops to think something is wrong with this Program- smile

  • JT
    JT
    It is not merely empty-headed scoffing at prophecy that prompts these thoughts, but rather an open-minded view at how bad things have been before and the progress mankind has made in various areas since then. True we don't have a perfect world now, but who would have traded life now for life in the 14th century?

    excellent point

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