I conclude evolution is guided (page 13)

KateWild

Kate, you should stay away from Cofty's wheelhouse. That's how I roll, and have done well doing so - onegen

Yes I should, but it's so tempting sometimes and it's fun too

KateWild

Prologs, good way to come up with a conclusion.

Ruby, sounds very interesting programme.

Giles Gray

KateWild-"If you want to you could do a bit of learning about the details in the OP and then formulate a specific question for me to challenge me or prove me wrong."

In deed I could, but far more interesting is the defensive manner you exibited when you feared that others could challenge you to the point of contradiction.

Your aversion to being challenged, or in this case feeling you were when you actually were not, has been quite fasinating to observe.

KateWild-"But it doesn't matter, cofty has made a specific point to challenge my conclusions and to try and prove me wrong. He is pretty straight forward about wanting to provide proof. I don't have a problem with that."

It would be good if that were true but you do have a problem when he challenges you. When Cofty has challenged you in other threads, you have taken it as an "attack" when he wasn't. Below is a classic example:-

KateWild-"Your allegations are unsubstantiated, and I feel attacked by you now, just because I disagree with you it doesn't mean I am dishonest."

I can read for myself he wasn't attacking you. I can also read for myself that both k99 and notsurewheretogo were not trying to "prove you wrong" as you accused them of.

So your false accusations of others obviously stem from some kind of angst you feel when faced with being contradicted. That's the part of this thread I have found most interesting.

KateWild

His paper is the absolute refutation of Kate's point. He proved that the "left-handedness" of life arose as an inevitable result of autocatalysis. It is not a sign of guidance it is bucket chemistry. - cofty

Yes that was the reason he wrote his paper. It wasn't to discuss with other scientists and chemists how to utilise autocatalytic reactions to accomplish more efficient organic synthesis. I mean if he was writing a paper for that reason we could conclude formation of organic compounds in nature are far superior to what scientists are able to synthesise.

I will make this topic the subject of my next but one thread in my Evolution is a Fact series and explain it in more detail. -cofty

Yes you've been promising this for years, but still no sign. Only I am interested anyway cofty. Most of the posters here don't really want to know about autocatalysis and homichirality

So imo she does agree with Kenso Soai - at least she does not contradict him - Ruby

Well it's not about agreeing or disagreeing with Soai. He just presents results, and does not draw conclusions about whether or not evolution is guided. But his results do support my conclusions, or confirm my bias.

Simon and Cofty have made my points, but I'll just add that to start with a preconceived belief and then try (unsuccessfully) to twist existing facts and theories to match that belief is the most dishonest form of thinking and reasoning there is. - Landy

Yes I agree with Simon, don't think cofty made the point though. But Yes I freely admit I must have some bias, but we all have. Cofty is just as much confirming his bias and twisting facts as I am. Like his idea of the reason for Soai's paper. But I only think it's dishonest if you deny that you are bias, and insist you are impartial when you're constantly looking for evidence to support your conclusions. Confirming your bias isn't always unsuccessful if you are satisfied with your results.

Kenso Soai's greatest scientific achievement was to show that homochirality occurs naturally - no guidance required. - cofty

Oh right my mistake, so it wasn't to discuss with other scientists and chemists how to utilise autocatalytic reactions to accomplish more efficient organic synthesis. You see cofty said it on the internet so it must be true

KateWild

I do sometimes wonder if intelligent life "has always been" rather than coming from "nothing". Like K99 said - I work at being comfortable not knowing. - Freddo

Thanks for your post. Being comfortable not knowing is a good way to live. Having fun with family and building bonds in the community is more important than filling time try to get definitive answers. Is there really a need?

konceptual99

Only I am interested anyway cofty. Most of the posters here don't really want to know about autocatalysis and homichirality

Why do you constantly presume to know what everyone else on the board is thinking, is motivated by and has an interest in? Maybe your ability to read minds is the reason why you can't get your head round why we can't read yours.

KateWild

I fail to see why such entity would merit our devotion, worship or service - Eden

Yes me too

In deed I could, but far more interesting is the defensive manner you exibited when you feared that others could challenge you to the point of contradiction. Your aversion to being challenged, or in this case feeling you were when you actually were not, has been quite fasinating to observe. - Giles

Well I took half an hour or more to explain in more detail why cofty's conclusion was flawed in my eyes and you haven't even read it Giles. But glad to see you're fascinated enough to quote mine other threads and post my comments out of context. It's nice that both me and cofty have our cheer leaders. At least with Ruby, she has researched Saoi's reaction, it doesn't matter if you don't though, you views are equally welcome.

So your false accusations of others obviously stem from some kind of angst you feel when faced with being contradicted. That's the part of this thread I have found most interesting. - Giles

Thank you for drawing your personal conclusions about me. I actually enjoy being challenged and enjoyed writing my post to explain in further detail why I draw the conclusion I have that you didn't bother to read. Glad you find it interesting.

KateWild

Why do you constantly presume to know what everyone else on the board is thinking, is motivated by and has an interest in? - K99

Opps sorry I didn't think it was constant. I am wrong though Ruby is interested too. She read the paper. But over the years when cofty has posted the link to the paper, no one else posted any chemistry in relation to it.

Have you read the links? Are you going to?

OneGenTwoGroups

Science IMO does not have all the answers. When I discover gaps in science, it's easy for me, as a temporary measure to fill in the gaps with God. I do this until I have learnt something new.
What about you? Do you believe in the god-of-the-gaps? If so, why? If not, why not?
Kate xx

Now I understand.

KateWild

Cool onegen you found that. Can you resurrect it for me please?

So three years ago my way of debating has slightly changed and my knowledge has increased. Instead of saying I believe in God of the gaps I apply Occam's Razor to explain that evolution is guided. It's more probable based on the scientific facts I have.

And some atheists also apply Occam's Razor too. We are both filling in gaps in science but with different explanations.

I conclude evolution is guided

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