Conditioned responses: Have you been conditioned to feel judged, or guilt etc that has spilled over into your exjw life?

by Diogenesister 18 Replies latest watchtower scandals

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  Diogenesister

  This YouTuber, an exjw and psychologist, may be familiar to some of the old guard.

  I'm posting for newer members really. Yet still, despite being out some time, it was a shock for me to realise that some of the crippling guilt I have felt over so much of my life, even long after being awake, was due to the dominant "conditioned response" I felt as a believer - guilt.

  Guilt that I could never do enough. Guilt that I was responsible for the life of anyone I didn't preach to...anyone I may have stumbled, anything I did that wasn't caring for the needs of others.

  Even My job I choose to fit in with trying to expunge the guilt I felt at not meeting the needs of others. And relationships....well....you can imagine. I was ripe to take the blame for any and all deficiencies or faults/issues my partner had.

  Some exjw, or ex members of other controlling religions, never shake the feeling of being judged. This interesting video by Theramin trees says at first people question whether they are really to blame and look at the issue rationally, but when a partner/employer/ whoever - in taking the place of God - doesn't respond to reason, the conditioned person quickly slides into the familiar feeling they know so well. That of being in the wrong and judged for their imperfection.

  Theramin trees questions who is really to be judged.....

  https://youtu.be/QRbnws-zITg
  
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  LongHairGal

  DIOGENESISTER:

  It is really amazing the amount of guilt and phobias the Witness religion tries to instill in their members. No wonder so many need therapy.

  I have a feeling though that it is mostly directed at women there. I was aware of this and I repelled the thoughts. How absurd to imagine that I am responsible for other people being “saved”. Well, then who is responsible for me?

  As far as what you say about “meeting other people’s needs”, forgive me..but I am laughing out loud! I’m the one who had the full-time job and was called “unspiritual”. These idiots who criticized me can go fly a kite.

  I hope you have shaken most of this sh#t off. They really did a number on your head. 😓The Jehovah’s Witness religion is seriously unhealthy and I am SO glad I left it.
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  dubstepped

  @LHG - Are you saying that the women were made to feel guilty and not the men? Maybe I mistook what you said.

  Anyway, absolutely. A life of "never being enough" is to live as a JW. I ended up suicidal thinking something must have been wrong with me because despite my best efforts I couldn't keep up with their expectations.

  We all received those messages. It was constant. Do more, be more, give more.

  There's a book out now called "The Four Tendencies" and I took the quiz and realized that rather than being a "questioner" I'm actually much more an "oblige". In our business we do great work for our clients but often at the expense of ourselves. I was conditioned not to say no. So guilt led me to do many things that I didn't want to do. We worked today and didn't have to, but we offered out of obligation and guilt.
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  stuckinarut2

  Great thread!

  Thanks for sharing this video and your thoughts.

  It is so healthy to re-evaluate and analyse why we are who we are.
  
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  LongHairGal

  DUBSTEPPED:

  Yes, that’s what I meant and maybe I’m wrong but that’s how it appeared to me when I was in.

  You’re probably right and I’m not gonna argue with you that the same message could be directed at both and a sensitive type of man can also feel guilt-tripped. And I’m sorry these bastards almost drove you over the edge.😪

  The reason I feel it was mostly directed at women as they are the only ones I saw targeted to do favors for all the users.

  In any case, I repelled the Witness shit, held onto my job and got out of the unhealthy religion.
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  stuckinarut2

  That book and quiz sounds interesting too Dub! I'll check it out
  
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  Xanthippe

  but when a partner/employer/ whoever - in taking the place of God - doesn't respond to reason, the conditioned person quickly slides into the familiar feeling they know so well. That of being in the wrong and judged for their imperfection.

  Yes I do sometimes find myself thinking up reasons why I did something, getting quite a detailed explanation ready ...... just in case. I suppose I'm expecting someone to criticise me and they almost never do.

  It's a conditioned response after thirty years of getting constant criticism, you're right. It's stressful and makes me anxious. I'm aware of having more anxiety than I should but not always sure why. Thanks for throwing some light on that Diogenesister.
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  dubstepped

  It's easy to only see our experience and our side of anything and to think we had it worse. If you want to discuss that start a thread and I'd be happy to do so. In the end I don't think any of it is necessarily more, just different.

  My dad was an asshole with zero empathy. Not a "sensitive type of man" like I am more of, and even he felt guilt. So much so that he could not take us fishing on a Saturday morning ever because he'd feel guilt if he wasn't there to lead the group in service. That's just one example. But you don't have to have a certain emotional makeup to feel guilt.

  As a kid I felt guilt when I had to lead a group of older and smarter women out in the ministry just because I was a guy. I had so many expectations on me as a brother to be an example, to give x amount of talks, to show progress, to "reach out", etc. Sometimes people think that because we brothers had power that somehow we had it easy. With great power comes great responsibility, not just responsibility in how it's used, but responsibility as in burden.

  In the end, like I said, it's not a matter of who had it worse, we just had it different between the males and females. Women maybe had more familial pressure, men more congregational. It all sucked.
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  dubstepped

  @SIAR2 - I'm blanking on her name, but I think the author does the podcast called Happier. I never read the book but I took her quiz and listened to some of her episodes on the different archetypes. She isn't trying to put anyone in a box either, that's why they're called tendencies and not absolutes. I liked how she gave credence to the fact that we likely have all of the four in different areas of life, but one tends to be more present.
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  LongHairGal

  DUBSTEPPED:

  Yes, we can both agree that our Witness experience sucked and we are glad to be done with it.👍🏻