Fear and paranoia plague me again

by LostMyReligion 12 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  LostMyReligion

  I really like being here on this board. I come to read it every day, and now I have the pleasure of reading others responses to my posts and commenting on theirs.

  But, I am beginning to feel a resurrgence on that fear and paranoia that kept me from speaking up before.
  after posting my notes on the convention, I began to feel a little guilty for ridiculing them when I know my son belives (as a result of my teaching) so strongly, and when I know so many good sincere friends at the KH who also believe so. My derisive comments are in no way directed at them, but I know they would be deeply wounded if they knew.

  I was reading silentlambs post about the July 15,2001 WT article "Are you Truly Tolerent?" Then I went to the mailbox and there was the magazine. I read through it and there are other upsetting statements made Such as:

  "Are you quick to act when corrupting influences are making inroads among your close associates? Prompt and firm action is sometimes required to stop the spread of serious sin."

  "Some aspect of a fellow believer's thinking or conduct may be somewhat out of harmony woth Jehovah's standards. Though the deviation may not yet be so serious as to lead to rejection by God, it may give a warning signal indicating that some adjustment is required."

  These comments seem pointed at rooting out variant thinking more than the typical other sins. Maybe being immersed in the indoctrinating atmosphere of the conv. all weekend has made this come up in me. But I suddenly have a great fear of being called to meet with a comittee who will hand me a printout of all my online conversations as damning evidence.

  I read about IP addresses and other ways to identify people. I do not know much about these things. How hard is it to be traced. I signed up here from a hotmail account which contains no personal info., but from things I say online one could correctly infer a lot. I unlocked my mailbox yesterday, and got a message from a reader who asked if I wanted to put my story on his site. This is scary. How much danger is there really? Probably I am just being paranoid, and no one really cares who I am , but has anyone else had any experience with losing their anonimity?

  LMR
• 

  Stephanus

  LMR, of course these articles are making you feel guilty about the stance you've taken, they're written by master manipulators with over a hundred years of practice! Don't back down now because they've made a blanket statement meant to frighten less determined ones back into the fold (or slaughteryard!). That's precisely what they intend to do. No, stand firm and continue to do what you're doing, holding up to the light the ridiculous statements of a controlling, human organisation which presumes itself to be God's voice on Earth!
• 

  RunningMan

  When someone tries to limit the information that you receive, or tries
  to get you to avoid persuing certain ideas, because they can be
  dangerous, a red flag should automatically go up. There is only one
  reason why anyone would want you to avoid certain information - because
  they have something to hide.

  The more that the society protests that you should avoid certain web sites
  or books, the more you should realize that they are hiding something. Actually,
  this site IS dangerous - to them.

  As far as being traced by your web site, I have been posting occasionally for
  about a year. There is more than enough information in my posting history to
  identify me. So far, no one has even attempted to track me down. And, I am
  still an active, regular, publisher.

  I must admit, though, that I succumb to the same paranoid ideas that you
  mentioned. For example, a while ago my cong secretary told me about
  two noteworthy cases of financial fraud in nearby congregations. These were
  extremely juicy stories, and I couldn't help but think that I was being set up.

  I guess we will remain paranoid, at least until they come to get us.
• 

  Amazing

  Hi LostMyReligion: I relate to your post and especially noted the 'guilt' you feel. Abusive religions and cults are expert at planting Guilt, doubt, and fear in our minds. This is a long term psychological growth that can, and often does, become very deep seated. It pops out when least expected, and plagues our hearts and minds.

  The WTS is very expert in this area. They manage to get us confused between normal healthy guilt when we err, and the type of never-ending guilt that they layer on top of our natural human emotions.

  Healthy, appropriate 'guilt' is only good for the immediate moment until we correct something, or resolve to not repeat or practice it. Then, once guilt serves its immediate purpose, it really needs to be disgarded. If not, it can eat away at us and cause us to never heal and learn from a negative experience.

  Example: When I have been careless and accidently run a red light, I feel guilty because of the safety hazard implications and because I allowed myself to be distracted or careless. But, once I have recognized what I have done, I then resolve to be more careful and then let it go.

  Watch Tower guilt a caused by making us needlessly question doubt and fear our every decision and action. We are made to feel that without them the devil has gotten hold of us and is making us do bad things. If we examine what it is we did, such as exercising freedom of speech on an Internet Forum, or eat birthday cake, or critically examine WTS dogma, our natural emotions would normally never feel any guilt. But, WTS rules make us not concerned with whether the criticism was true, or the speech was correct, or the cake was bad in someway, but that we doubt our actions, and feel like we are being disloyal, hypocritical, and leaving God.

  But, that is far from the case. Rather, our normal humanity is trying to break through as we search, grow, question, criticize, examine, debate, experiment with different ideas, and take charge of our lives. It is this very act of taking our lives back into our own rightful control that seems so uncomfortable, and generates this unhealthy guilt deeply planted through years of WTS indoctrination.

  Rather than dismiss the 'guilt', recognize it, honor it, explore it, and then let it go as you come to realize that its source is from a 'high control of the mind' tactics of the Watch Tower Society.

  I have posted two new posts called Taking Our Lives Back, #2 aND #3 that touch on some of this. I hope you will read them and let me know if they are helpful to you. - Amazing
• 

  Copernicus

  LMR:

  Very interesting. . .

  I was able to identify completely with your post, and I know it would be very difficult for any non-witness to have a clue of what you’re talking about, or to understand the intense nature of the experience.

  When I went through these sorts of episodes, I imagined that Jehovah was sending his earthly servants to warn me (even if they themselves didn’t realize what they were doing). After all, he had seen what they hadn’t. Right? The eerie sense of foreboding that would overcome me at those moments was terrifying, and enough to make me arrest any aberrant (ie: breaking WTS rules) behavior. When I would open magazines at times like those, even randomly, I’d get the feeling that I had been drawn to read this. . . that I was being communicated with. It was all to damn spooky for me.

  I don’t have those feelings anymore. And you won’t either if you break the conditioning. I couldn’t live my life with the paranoia that comes from thinking I’m being watched, and reported on by invisible beings, as the society teaches we are. Hey, if they want to report something, why don’t they report some accurate prophecy, huh? Get my point? The feelings aren’t real. Let it go. It will pass in time. If you don’t, you’ll never overcome the invisible barrier they’ve erected around your mind with their constant programming.

  Good luck! And don’t be afraid to speak what you know to be truth, EVER! Even a JW is entitled to an opinion. Or so I think. It’s hard to balance these things when you don’t want to see close family members hurt. I understand and sympathize.
• 

  LDH

  I guess we will remain paranoid, at least until they come to get us.

  Runningman, that was brilliant. LOL.

  LMR, Fred Hall and You Know have been baiting people for years, and believe me there are PLENTY of us who would love to unmask them. But, you can be anonymous if you choose to be, and that's that. Just keep your email locked.
• 

  Moxy

  LDH is right. you have virtually no need to worry about being caught by some mysterious IP-based method you werent familiar with. if someone is caught it is far more likely to be something simple like positively identifying comments or someone seeing you surf either by just watching you or checking a browser's history or cache. clearing a browser cache and history are easy to do.

  in internet explorer: View > Internet Options : click 'Delete Files' & 'Clear History'

  in netscape: Edit > Prefences > Advanced > Cache : 'Clear' buttons and Edit > Preferences > Navigator : 'Clear' buttons

  mox
• 

  Victor_E

  Hi LMR,
  You wrote
  ____________________________________________________________________
  But, I am beginning to feel a resurrgence on that fear and paranoia that kept me from speaking up before.
  after posting my notes on the convention, I began to feel a little guilty for ridiculing them when I know my son belives (as a result of my teaching) so strongly, and when I know so many good sincere friends at the KH who also believe so.
  ______________________________________________________________________
  What you are feeling is a triple bind; "damn if you do damn if you don't" on 3 fronts. A part of you fears the consequences of you being discovered, another part of you wants to come out of the closet and expose the great damage done by the religion, and still another part feels a loyalty and honor towards your son. In a case like this you have to want what you don't want by you deciding what is the most important thing you want to happen. This may be situational hiearchy depending on the variables of the day situation, etc. In plain English you can not please yourself and others all the time.

  ______________________________________________________________________
  My derisive comments are in no way directed at them, but I know they would be deeply wounded if they knew.
  ______________________________________________________________________

  They would feel a betrayal on your part towards the religion you forced upon them that they have now made their own.
  ____________________________________________________________________
  I was reading silentlambs post about the July 15,2001 WT article "Are you Truly Tolerent?" Then I went to the mailbox and there was the magazine. I read through it and there are other upsetting statements made Such as:
  _____________________________________________________________________
  This is all a play of words that have registered in your unconscious mind as I have now mark out certain emphasis.

  "Are you quick to act when corrupting influences are making inroads among your close associates?
  Registers as:
  "YOU ARE QUICK TO ACT ON CORRUPTING INFLUENCES!
  This is an embeded command and this is how you neutraize it.
  1. According to whom am I supposed to do this?
  2. What will happen if I do or don't?
  3. What specific corrupting influence according to whom and how specifically am I supposed to act quick doing what specifically?

  Prompt and firm action is sometimes required to stop the spread of serious sin."

  Registers as:
  FIRM ACTION IS REQUIRED TO STOP THE SPREAD OF SERIOUS SIN!
  1. What specific firm action is required by whom?
  2. What lets you know it's serious sin?
  3. What will happen if I don't take any action to report any sin?

  "Some aspect of a fellow believer's thinking or conduct may be somewhat out of harmony woth Jehovah's standards.

  Registers as:
  A FELLOW BELIEVER'S THINKING OR CONDUCT BE OUT OF HARMONY WITH JEHOVAH'S STANDARDS!

  Though the deviation may not yet be so serious as to lead to rejection by God, it may give a warning signal indicating that some adjustment is required."
  Registers as:
  THE DEVIATION BE SERIOUS TO LEAD TO REJECTION BY GOD, SOME ADJUSTMENT IS REQUIRED!
  1. What specific deviation is serious according to whom, to how specificaly lead to rejection by God.
  2. What specific adjustment is required by whom?
  3. What lets you know this?

  __________________________________________________________________
  These comments seem pointed at rooting out variant thinking more than the typical other sins.
  ___________________________________________________________________
  These comments are carefully written to program fear,shame, and guilt, very typical diet of words of the Watchtower. This type of word diet leads to fuzy gummy thinking that leads to paranoia.
  _____________________________________________________________________
  Maybe being immersed in the indoctrinating atmosphere of the conv. all weekend has made this come up in me.
  ____________________________________________________________________

  Yes, until you learn to filter embeded commands and post hypnotic sugestions your mind will continue to be assulted by the JWs.
  ___________________________________________________________________
  But I suddenly have a great fear of being called to meet with a comittee who will hand me a printout of all my online conversations as damning evidence.

  I read about IP addresses and other ways to identify people. I do not know much about these things. How hard is it to be traced. I signed up here from a hotmail account which contains no personal info., but from things I say online one could correctly infer a lot. I unlocked my mailbox yesterday, and got a message from a reader who asked if I wanted to put my story on his site. This is scary. How much danger is there really? Probably I am just being paranoid, and no one really cares who I am , but has anyone else had any experience with losing their anonimity?
  ____________________________________________________________________
  In this I am no expert, and I will leave this part of those here that are. Just take whatever precautions you need to, to protect your anonimity. Reminds of when I was reading apostate's books right in front of my JW former wife, I changed out the covers and she thought I was reading my regular psychology books, the things we do to protect ourselves in our own homes.
• 

  LostMyReligion

  Thanks guys for the supporting words! Several of you mentioned the manipulation (Stephanus), the information control (Running Man), and the implanted fears and guilt (Amazing). I recognize the existence fof these things intellectually. The trick I am still trying to master is recognizing them emotionally. Time and practice, I guess.

  Amazing:
  Many thanks for all you wrote and your other articles. I posted a thank you on your thread.

  Copernicus:
  I loved your point, "If invisible beings want to report something, why don't they report some accurate prophesy!"
  I definitely have to remember that one.

  Running Man;
  "I guess we will remain paranoid, at least until they come to get us." That's the ticket all right!

  Moxy:
  Thanks for the computer hints.

  Victor_E:
  Thanks very much for your insightful analysis. I appreciated reading it, especially the part about the triple bind. That's it exactly, but sorting it out is very challenging. The point about the embedded commands and how to neutralize them is a very helpful technique to work with.

  Thanks again.

  LMR
• 

  thinkers wife

  LMR,
  I think we all go through this paranoia at one time or another. I also think there is a converse side to this looking at it through an active witness' eyes.
  When I was on my way out of the org., unbeknownst to my family. I was involved in some situations that were definitely in the category the Witnesses would call wrong doing, gross sin.
  In the meantime, there were some very good things happening in my life, which of course I shared with my Witness mother. She kept attributing these good things to Jehovah. It gave me pause for thought. Because I knew according to their rules I was definitely sinning, yet good things in abundance were still happening in my life. Perhaps it is just a matter of looking throught the other end of the telescope?
  TW