Genesis 6:3

by Globetrotter 12 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Globetrotter
    Globetrotter

    I know that this has been talked about already under a different context, but I had another question about it....

    The December 15 WT claims that Genesis 6:3 started a 120 year countdown to the flood.

    Our Watchfulness Takes On Greater Urgency

    Warned of ?Things Not Yet Beheld?

    6 In Noah?s day, Jehovah declared: ?My spirit shall not act toward man indefinitely in that he is also flesh. Accordingly his days shall amount to a hundred and twenty years.? (Genesis 6:3) The issuance of this divine decree in 2490 B.C.E. marked the beginning of the end for that ungodly world.

    My question is whether anyone ever thought this verse to mean something other than god limiting how long a man would live. All of the preceding chapter (Gen 5) describes men living hundreds of years old. It seems that this is an amazing jump for the WT to make.
  • onacruse
    onacruse

    Interesting question. Though many commentators deny that this refers to a lifespan limit (e.g. Gill and Jameison, Fausset & Brown), a number of modern exegetes consider it to be so. The New Jerusalem Bible renders the verse:

    Yahweh said, 'My spirit cannot be indefinitely responsible for human beings, who are only flesh; let the time allowed each be a hundred and twenty years.'

    ftn:

    According to the Yahwistic source this is the maximum allowed by God...

    NIV reads:

    ...his days will be a hundred and twenty years.

    ftn:

    The verse seems to announce that the period of grace between God's declaration of judgment ...But if the NIV text note is accepted, the verse announces that man's life span would henceforth be limited to 120 years...

    Abingdon is unequivocal:

    A limit of a hundred and twenty years is fixed, that man may not live long enough to encroach on the prerogatives of his Maker.

    Calvin's commentary holds to the "old line," but observes that there is a consequent discrepancy to explain:

    ?Yet his days shall be one hundred and twenty years.?

    Certain writers of antiquity, such as Lactantius, and others, have too grossly blundered in thinking that the term of human life was limited within this space of time; whereas, it is evident, that the language used in this place refers not to the private life of any one, but to a time of repentance to be granted to the whole world. Moreover, here also the admirable benignity of God is apparent, in that he, though wearied with the wickedness of men, yet postpones the execution of extreme vengeance for more than a century. But here arises an apparent discrepancy. For Noah departed this life when he had completed nine hundred and fifty years. It is however said that he lived from the time of the deluge three hundred and fifty years. Therefore, on the day he entered the ark he was six hundred years old. Where then will the twenty years be found? The Jews answer, that these years were cut off in consequence of the increasing wickedness of men. But there is no need of that subterfuge; when the Scripture speaks of the five hundredth year of his age, it does not affirm, that he had actually reached that point. And this mode of speaking, which takes into account the beginning of a period, as well as its end, is very common. Therefore, inasmuch as the greater part of the fifth century of his life was passed, so that he was nearly five hundred years old, he is said to have been of that age.

    Footnote

    {4} The whole of this passage might have been more clearly expressed. At the close of chapter 5, it is said, ?Noah was five hundred years old: and Noah begat Shem, Ham, and Japeth.? In the verse on which Calvin here comments, it is stated, that man?s days on earth ?shall be one hundred and twenty years?; but in Genesis 7:11, we are told, that the deluge came ?in the six hundredth year of Noah?s life.? This would pare down the one hundred and twenty years to one hundred; and therefore Calvin asks, ?Where are the remaining twenty to be found?? To answer this question, he shows that there was something indefinite in the statement of Noah?s age in the first of these passages, and Moses does not say that the flood began precisely in that year. He therefore concludes that, according to a common mode of speaking among the Hebrews, he was in the fifth century of his life; and therefore he would infer, that Noah was about four hundred and eighty years of age at the time referred to: if one hundred and twenty years be added, it will make him six hundred years old at the time of his entering the ark. ?Ed.

    Craig
  • robhic
    robhic

    Interesting, also, because a little further down "giants" are mentioned and then something about the offspring of the "sons of god" who went unto (we all know what that means... ) the women of men. Is this alluding to the possibility that the union of angels and earthly women produced giants? Was Goliath's daddy an angel? Hmm...

    Then it goes on to talk about the iniquity of these men. Now, wait a minute -- aren't many of the earthly beings the offspring of angels by the above statement? Why did man get the full force of the J-man's vengance when some of the population were by his minions, the angels? It seems to me that some of the blame falls squarely on the angels and by default on their heavenly creator jehovah! Somebody's playing favorites.

    The wickedness of the earth was furthered by the damn angels spawning iniquitous offspring with our women and then man takes the hit. Pretty unfair, IMO.

    Robert

  • simwitness
    simwitness
    Yahweh said, 'My spirit cannot be indefinitely responsible for human beings..."

    ok, so I thought yahweh was omnipotent, and here he states he "cannot" do somehting? or is it he will not? Or that he no longer wants the responsibility?

    Talk about a "deadbeat dad"....

  • Satanus
    Satanus

    If it referred to lifespan, why did noah live way past that, even after the pronouncement? God breaking his own rules again?

    SS

  • Yerusalyim
    Yerusalyim

    My opinion is that it's simply a device by the writers to transition from the "old age" attributed to the heros of the myths to the fact that humans didn't usually live to be even 80 years old. The old age was attributed to great men and didn't really reflect their true age at death. The Babylonians did the same...some of their kings being said to be 34,000 years old...YIKES.

    Discovery had an interesting theory on the Noah flood last night...combining it with a convincing comparison with the legend of Gilgamesh and relating it to a possible historical setting where the Euphrates valley flooded and "Noah" was swept out to sea, settling in Bahrain.

    I personally think it's a combination of "flood stories" and flood memories.

  • Blueblades
    Blueblades

    Just a thought.What is the real significance of the Rainbow?

  • Leolaia
    Leolaia
    Was Goliath's daddy an angel? Hmm...

    Goliath was presented as a Philistine, but indeed in Numbers the words "Nephilim" and "Rephaim" are used to describe some of the gigantic inhabitants of the land who preceded the Israelites. In ancient Canaanite lore, the Rephaim were the primeval legendary kings of old, were somewhat divine, and presently reside in Sheol. The Hebrew texts that present the Nephilim and Rephaim as still living knew nothing of a Flood, which was a later accretion to their primeval history. The Israelites adopted the Canaanite legends about these "men of old, men of renown," one of whom was possibly Nimrod (he was separated from the Nephilim story when the Flood legend was added to the primeval history, but he was described in Genesis 10:8 as the "first gibbor on the earth" and the Nephilim in Genesis 6 are also described as gibbor "mighty ones"). Another famous Rephaim of old was the wise king Danel, who in a Canaanite epic poem fought to have his dead son Aqhat brought back to life, and this Danel was alluded to several times in Ezekiel as an ancient hero of old. In later Jewish tradition, as the Nephilim and Rephaim were associated with fallen angels, Danel was construed as one of the fallen angels (1 Enoch 6:7).

    I have written a bunch of threads on this subject in the Bible discussion folder.

  • Leolaia
    Leolaia

    Yerusalyim......Yeah, I was waiting for years and years and years for a documentary to take that approach on Noah's Flood....finally! The main problem, though, is that they don't fully separate the possible "real story" from any preexisting Flood stories the Sumerians might have had from living for hundreds of years along the Tigris and Euphrates. I have wondered whether such a Flood might have come right at the transition of the Ubaidian and Sumerian civilizations -- that the flood crippled Ubaidian society, allowing the Sumerians to move right in and take over the culture. The Sumerian king list places the Flood right before their dynasties, and view the antediluvian kings as mainly from Eridu which as I recall fits better with the Ubaidian civilization. The names of the cities and toponyms in Sumeria also, incidentally, are Ubaidian and not of Sumerian origin. The obvious question would be whether the thick silt layer at Ur (and other cities, from what I recall) corresponds chronologically to this change in culture or whether it instead intervenes in the middle of Sumerian deposits instead of at the boundary between Sumerian and Ubaidian strata.

  • robhic
    robhic
    main problem, though, is that they don't fully separate the possible "real story" from any preexisting Flood stories the Sumerians might have had from living for hundreds of years along the Tigris and Euphrates.

    Leolaia, I read another book (must have too much time on my hands ) that was quite interesting and backed by a lot of scientific evidence and data. In a nutshell, the author states that it seems a very real possibility that the flood did indeed happen -- just not when and how the bible renders it.

    It seems that the evidence shows that during a period of global warming, the resulting increase in sea levels from melting ice caps and glaciers resulted in a huge flood that overflowed the Mediterranean Sea into the Black Sea (which was more like the Black Lake before this flood) thru the Bosphorus Strait and raised the level as much as a hundred feet or more (if my memory is correct).

    This is all backed up by geological, scientific and photographic evidence from the sea floor done by Dr. Robert Ballard of 'Titanic' fame. It is fascinating and quite convincing. The flood is a reality -- its biblical circumstances and chronology are not.

    Robert

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