by shamus 22 Replies latest watchtower child-abuse
This is exactly why it is important for us not to lie about serious matters. Once people mark you as a liar... that?s it... they will no longer be able to tell when you are telling the truth.
He painted himself into an ugly corner and he has only himself to blame.
This is not the first time I have seen something like this happen... and it always ends the same: The known liar is left with no recourse because no one believes him.
Yes, elsewhere, and that's totally true. HOwever, is that part of a psyche of a person who has been abused? If so, he probably couldn't help it.
Shamus
I have dealt with many abuse survivors over the years.
Some lie and some do everything in their power not to lie.
As said before lying can be a way to get attention or a way to hide the truth.
It does sound as if your friend was in crisis mode and definitely in need of professional help. You needed to take care of yourself. People in crisis who are not getting the help they need can easily overwhelm those around them. You do a person in this situation no service to hang in there and buy into the lies. Eventually he knew he would be caught and find a way to leave - which is what he did.
BTW I come from a family of compulsive liars. I hate people who lie. Your story of your friend lying about his mother reminds me that one of my brothers told his boss our mother had died. When no one could contact my brother my mom whent to his work to ask about him and the boss told her he had taken a few days off because his mother died. And my mother's always tactful response was: "No I'm not. I'm right here." Needless to say he lost his job. This was pretty typical of him and he was always caught.
Another of my brothers was a really good liar - still is and still thinks he can get away with it. And he does for a while - he is pretty good. And the third brother would make you wonder but usually we could tell when he was lying.
My sister and mother don't even know what the truth is anymore. They have lied to cover the lies so much they don't know what they said.
And I always wondered why people would fall for my father's lies. But then I knew all the facts and they only knew what he told them.
No wonder I have a hard time trusting people. I would rather be silent than tell a lie. As a defense against liars I have developed a pretty good BS detector.
Now I'll tell you that everyone in my family has been sexually abused including both parents. Do they lie because they were sexually abused? Perhaps. But there was also so many other problems in the family. Maybe they lie because they were taught to. It might be a part of it but then it just might be a learned behavior.
And let's face it many JWs, especially those who get into leading the double life, become pretty good self-liars.
If so, he probably couldn't help it.At what point is a person responsible for what they do?
It took you a while, but you realized he was unreliable - a liar. Do you think that he may have changed in the passing years, and that he won't lie to you any more?
Shamus -
When he told you he was molested, was it before or after the silentlambs cases were exposed? The reason I ask is because if it were before, I would personally tend to believe him. If it was after, based upon other behaviors you've cited, I might be suspicious he could be "jumping on the bandwagon" for attention that he may have felt he wasn't getting or hadn't gotten at some point in his life. This isn't to say that he definitely was lying or telling the truth in either instance, however, it might be something to take into consideration, since depression manifests itself in so many different ways. It could have been his way of crying for help in hopes of filling a void that he needed filled at that time, or it could have been real. Either way, I think it would be good for BOTH of you to try to track him down to see how he is doing. As Heather said, even if he tells you where you can go, at least you will know that he is okay and you can relieve your own conscience - 'cuz I know you're beating yourself up over this. Even if you can't bring yourself to look him up, just know that it is normal and healthy to set boundaries with other people. If the lying was more than you could handle, you are no different than 99.99% of the population, and drawing the line with him was NOT wrong. It's okay to put your foot down, and normal to want to walk away from someone who can't be trusted.
:-)
growedup
The thing is, growedup, I'm sure he's dead. I don't know how someone can be in pain that much to lie like that. He was in agony. How can someone tell lies about being molested?
If he did, he needed help more than I could have given him.
I'm just going to forget about it. I guess that my conscience is cleared, although I still don't feel good about saying that.
I really don't know what to say on this............only in the past I found myself making up stories for ppl to find me interesting, you know to just kinda "add" to a story.
I have never lied about abuse though.
Other then that I really don't know what to say about your friend.
(((((((((((shamus))))))))))
I hope you don't blame yourself for not talking to him after such a big lie........that is a bit over the top to say your mother has cancer when she doesn't.
I would have done the same thing you did honey...........it is normal to not want to be around someone who lies to this degree.
Love,
Jes
Thanks, Jes.
It makes me feel a lot better knowing that I didn't do wrong from abuse survivors. I just need to get over this chapter in my life. It still hurts thinking about it, and I usually just forget about it, only to have it come up again.
I sure hope that he got the help that he needed. In any event, I guess it's not my responsibility anymore to worry.
Thanks all. I'll try to put this to rest at least for my conscience. There is so much pain in the world and I frequently tire of having this constantly come up whenever I get down.
Shamus you were a friend and that friendship was betrayed. And in spite of the betrayal you still care. Your heart is good. Worrying won't help you and it certainly won't help him.
Let it rest friend - let it go
Shamus - there is simply no way for you to know one way or the other. It is possible he was abused, and that his life has become a blur of reality/fantasy ever since.
However, only a good doctor can figure that one out for sure. I would firmly tell this friend that you will be there for him, as long as he is being there for himself by getting the appropriate help.
You're a good man Shamus - hats off to you.
