In my early 20's, I looked into the SDA's, seeing as how they have similar belief structure, and have many local Congregations, schools, etc. I didn't care for what I found. They have ELDERS (red flag #1), are very Pharasitical (red flag #2), and I also discovered that they shunned those who leave (red flag #3). This combined with their eerily familiar literature that I discovered at a STAND at a local Fair (red flag #4) had me running for the hills, as it felt like dejavu all over again. No thanks!
slimboyfat joins the Seventh Day Adventists!
by slimboyfat 34 Replies latest members private
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WingCommander
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slimboyfat
A reasonable defence of the Seventh Day Adventist church here:
Among many other issues he makes the point that SDA have an unfair reputation for setting dates for the end of the world. In fact the SDA church has never set a date for Armageddon (in contrast with JWs). They are tarnished by association with the earlier Adventist movement which claimed 1843 and 1844 would see Jesus return. But the SDA church itself never set any dates, I believe he is correct on that point.
I asked one woman at the church when Jesus would return. She said we can't know the day and the hour but it is very soon. I pressed her how soon. She said within 10 or 20 years for sure.
If SDAs practice shunning that is disappointing. Is it to the same extent as JWs? Is it formal or informal? I would be interested in the details.
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shepherdless
I thought I read that SDA's stopped shunning about 17 years ago. I can't verify that.
SBF's post made me think that a lot of SDA's are sub-saharan African other areas where Christianity is very strong. Using 2016 Aust census data, I extracted place of birth for adherents of both JW and SDA, in the following table. I hope the table is self-explanatory.
"Oceania and Antarctica" essentially means Aust and NZ. There does seem to be quite a few more sub-saharan Africans and Asians in SDA than in the Borg. I don't know the reason.
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shepherdless
SDA is doing far better than the Borg in Aust. While it suffered a very tiny decline in numbers between 2011 and 2016 (going from 63,002 to 62,948), most other religions suffered a bigger decline. I haven't checked thoroughly, but I think SDA might be the best performer of the Christian religions. The Borg numbers decreased from 85,635 to 82,512 over the same period.
The following is a chart comparing nos of adherents for the 2011 census:
Now look at the same chart comparing nos of adherents for the 2016 census:
SDA's are clearly got more youth (as a percentage of their overall numbers, not in absolute terms) and are holding onto their youth more effectively than the Borg.
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steve2
cofty, good point.
A book came out in the late 1970s/early 1980s authored by a SDA minister; it was called, "The White Lie". He was "defrocked" (I think that's the term used by SDAs when a minister loses his position). He could no longer practise as a minister in the SDA.
True be told, quite why he wanted to remain in the church puzzled me, given the pervasiveness of issues he had against it.
My own contact with the SDA church goes back to my youth: My best friend at school was a SDA (which looking back was strange given I was a JW). I remember how "quiet" his home was in contrast to my noisy family. My JW mother said it was okay to visit his home after school provided I didn't 'bring home anything' which I knew even without her saying meant religious material.
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Laika
As I understand it they do not practice formal shunning but do encourage their members to keep their friendships and marriages within the SDA church, much like JWs in that sense, which I imagine would still have an effect on leavers.
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slimboyfat
Thanks for the stats shepherdless.
Very interesting statistical info in the official SDA report too.
http://documents.adventistarchives.org/Statistics/ASR/ASR2016.pdf
Check out the financials: $3.5 billion income, including $2.5 billion from tithing, which is an increase of $132 million over the previous year. What Watchtower would do to have those figures! It tends to confirm my impression that SDAs have a much more secure income stream and growth profile than JWs.
As I understand it, SDA churches in Britain mainly comprise African and Asian immigrants. There are some white British SDAs but not many. SDAs in general do very poorly in Europe (apart from among immigrants). But they more than make up for it in most other parts of the world, especially Africa.
Plus in a strange way the SDA reliance on immigrant populations in Britain may be an advantage for future growth. Because immigrant communities are growing in Britain, have greater fertility, and tend to stick to their faith. Whereas the predominantly white British JWs face steady decline in line with their demographic and its increasing secularity.
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WingCommander
What is this? An SDA apologists forum now? SDA's never set a date for the end of the world? Ummm.......BULLSHIT!!!!! This is just more glossing over of the facts, ALA JW stye, except in SDA form.
Ellen G. White was the Fred Franz of the SDA's. She was their Oracle!!!! (Fred's nickname at Bethel) She was a total false prophet, just like CT Russell, etc.
More poison fruit, from a different branch of the tree. (Second Adventist Movement, Millerite Movement)
Gees.......I can't belief how gullible some people are on here. Trade in one cult, for another! And no, I'm not an Atheist, but after looking into SDA's myself, there's no way in hell I'd ever join up with them. It'd be like going from Slice, to Sprite. Same flavour of CRAZY. I'm serious! Have you seen their literature?????? It's end-times apocalyptic WT bullshit, all over again!
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slimboyfat
I know exactly the places where Russell said Armageddon would come before 1914, and Rutherford said the princes would return in 1925, and Franz said 1975 was a marked year.
Have you got comparable references for SDA dates? I don't know any. That's not "apologetics" it's just a question.
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LV101
Out of the mouths of a couple in Loma Linda/Redlands, CA (SDA community) they still shun or the ones my friends are acquainted with shun. They wouldn't make this up because they think SDAs are the best people in the world! Maybe shunning is a personal choice for each member.