Achieving Salvation

desib77

The other night, I had a couple of pastors over to try to answer some questions I had. They came prepared to "save me" and even tried to do so. Tonight I bought a book that mentioned being saved by accepting the work of Christ and asking Jesus to save me. It states that I would be "born again" and made a new person.

Of course with my JW background I'm having a difficult time understanding being saved and having a difficult time accepting it.

I just wondered what everyone's take on this is. Do you feel that this is a necessary process? Why does it have to be done in front of someone? Why isn't it just a personal process?

It is also tough for me to accept achieving salvation through faith and not works..."faith without works is dead" keeps repeating over and over in my mind.....

Faust

I think you should follow whatever your heart tells you to do. I found my personal "salvation" by believing in a God who loves us unconditionally, just for who we are. I think everyone has their own path, however, and it is up to you to find it and find your peace in it.

May you find your way soon desib :-).

bebu

Why does it have to be done in front of someone? Why isn't it just a personal process?

It has to be done in front of someone?? ?? That's news. It is SUPPOSED to be a personal process. Are you sure you understood those pastors right??

Thoughts about "work"...

Speaking off the top of my head... Salvation, I guess, is just agreeing to put God back in His rightful spot. That is a "work", if you will. You say you're sorry (repent) for the things you know you did were wrong. That's another "work", I think. Faith is a "work", as it really pays a compliment to God in a great way, when you think about it... ("This is the work of God, to believe on the one He has sent.") . Forgiving those who have wronged you is one of the greatest "works" that result from all of the above. Acting charitably is a "work"--this has very, very broad application.

You really, really have to realize that what God means by "work" and what you've been trained to understand as "work" are two different things. When you realize this, you will probably feel a great weight lift off your shoulders.

Thoughts about being born again...

God is good and His love gave us what we needed: a savior. Taking that offer results in God recreating you, since now you've given permission. You don't think much (or at all) about each breath you take, nevertheless you automatically breathe and you grow, so likewise, don't fret about "feelings" or definitions or theology about what is God is doing. Just do whatever you KNOW you should, and God will graciously get the process rolling for you, even while you might be very unaware of it. Be faithful in the little things you know: live simply, with charity to men and humility before God, and trust in God's love. God will be pleased, and help you at your own pace to bigger things.

My thoughts.

bebu

Double Edge

I think being born again is very 'personal' .

I like the way James puts it:

James 2:18
Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.

In other words, if you do follow the example of Christ, walk the walk, don't just talk the talk.

Narkissos

As a good Bible reader, I spontaneously associated a number of Bible expressions, including "being born again", to the personal experience which eventually led me out of the JWs. Incidentally, most of this experience occurred to me right in Bethel, without any contact with any other religion.

When I later got in touch with Evangelicals, they were quite surprised I could have had such an experience "alone" (it was not alone actually, some JW friends were involved). I was surprised that any genuine personal experience could result of an organized process, such as a Billy Graham show (I even attended one...).

People's experience and way of telling it differ (according to their cultural and social environment). We all know here how fashioning one's experience after the expectation of any group is mind- and life-trapping. Never forget that religious formulas, such as being "born again" or "saved", are nothing but metaphors (as is any word in language except the verb "to be", as Derrida says)...

Undecided

I think I'm lost. If salvation depends on believing that God is so loving and careing for mankind, how do we account for all the bad diseases and suffering to those who have been saved? Does God really give a damn about us lowly humans? When an earthquake kills thousands of people, or a volcano erupts, or tornado does it's work, can we just blame one human in the past who sinned? If God wanted us saved, why did he make us so weak in the first place? I just can't understand.

Ken P.

bebu

People's experience and way of telling it differ (according to their cultural and social environment). We all know here how fashioning one's experience after the expectation of any group is mind- and life-trapping. Never forget that religious formulas, such as being "born again" or "saved", are nothing but metaphors (as is any word in language except the verb "to be", as Derrida says)...

I heartily agree! Nicely put.

bebu

Dawn

Hi Desib:

I do believe it is a personal thing - you don't have to accept Jesus in front of anyone if you don't feel comfortable doing so.

As for the faith vs. works thing. An interesting study for you - look in a biblical concordance for the New Testament verses about eternal life - you will find in every verse that this is a "gift" - it is always a "gift" - it can not be earned through any action of our own. (Heb 11: 7-9 - saved by faith).

Now there is a second thing spoken of in the New Testament - and that is "rewards". If you look in your concordance for the verses speaking of "rewards" you will find that rewards can be earned by works, and also can be lost.

So to put it simply - by accepting Jesus as your savior you receive a free "gift" of life. You can't earn this - if you could, well then, what reason would you need Jesusl? But you can't earn it - it is given to you because of your faith. Once you have received this free gift you can earn "rewards" (I suppose something that is given you in heaven - remember the 'storing up treasure in heaven' scriptures).

The reason this is confusing is that JW's combine the two - the gift and the rewards - and say that everlasting life must be earned through works.

Now for that scripture - faith without works is dead. Well - isn't that true? If we REALLY have faith, then our life will show that in some way - not through our own doing but because Jesus is working through us. It's not something we do - it's something HE does in us that makes us change. This scripture is pointing at those who simply say they have faith, but really don't, and have not accepted Jesus as their savior. Read it in context and it will make more sense.

I hope this has helped you.

Achieving Salvation

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