Blondie's "...Comments..." thread made me think

by robhic 12 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  robhic

  In Blondie's excellent, as usual, "Comments you won't hear..." thread I happened to look up the 1 Corinthians 7:27 cite at the top about "time being shortened."
  

  As I read further, I came upon the verse at 1 Co 7:36. I used the "compare" function of my eSword electronic bible program and look at these results between these different versions of the bible:

  1Co 7:36

  (ASV)

  But if any man thinketh that he behaveth himself unseemly toward his virgin daughter , if she be past the flower of her age, and if need so requireth, let him do what he will; he sinneth not; let them marry.

  (BBE)

  But if, in any man's opinion, he is not doing what is right for his virgin, if she is past her best years, and there is need for it, let him do what seems right to him; it is no sin; let them be married.

  (Darby)

  But if any one think that he behaves unseemly to his virginity, if he be beyond the flower of his age, and so it must be, let him do what he will, he does not sin: let them marry.

  (DRB)

  But if any man think that he seemeth dishonoured with regard to his virgin, for that she is above the age, and it must so be: let him do what he will. He sinneth not if she marry.

  (ISV)

  If a man thinks he is not behaving properly toward his virgin, and if his passion is too strong and he feels he ought to, let him do what he wants; he isn't sinning. Let them get married.

  (KJV)

  But if any man think that he behaveth himself uncomely toward his virgin, if she pass the flower of [her] age, and need so require, let him do what he will, he sinneth not: let them marry.

  (LITV)

  But if anyone thinks it behaving indecently toward his virgin (if she is beyond her prime, and so it ought to be), let him do what he desires; he does not sin; let them marry.

  (MKJV)

  But if anyone thinks it behaving himself indecently toward his virgin (if she is past her prime, and so it ought to be) let him do what he will; he does not sin; let them marry.

  (NWT)

  But if anyone thinks he is behaving improperly toward his virginity, if that is past the bloom of youth, and this is the way it should take place, let him do what he wants; he does not sin. Let them marry.

  All-in-all, this seems quite disturbing. In the American Standard Version (first quote) it seems to condone marrying your virgin daughter if she is past her prime! The rest of the versions seem to skirt around the issue and make the object of marriage "his virgin" and "your virgin past her prime."

  So what does that mean? Your virgin? Sounds very nudge-nudge, wink-wink (Monty Python mode...) to mean your daughter as in the first scripture above. Can this be?

  OK, all you scholars out there, what is this verse implying? I'm intrigued and a bit creeped out at the same time!

  Robert
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  little witch

  This is speaking of the fathers matchmaking for his daughter (a common duty at that time and still practiced in many societies in the east and mid east)
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  Elsewhere

  No... this has nothing to do with match making... the father could not sell his virgin daughter and she is getting old... so he just takes her for himself.
• 

  little witch

  NIV VERSION

  "If anyone thinks He is acting improperly toward the virgin he is engaged to, and she is getting along in years and he feels he ought to marry, he should do so as he wants".

  It goes on to say that feeling he doesn't want to marry this "older woman" (meaning I think, beyond childbearing years) does right also. In other words, there is no instruction but up to the conscience.

  I spoke in error on the last post.
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  SixofNine

  Wow, creepy anyway you look at it.

  Creepiest: Dude! Just marry your daughter if your gonna act that way; at least then your grandchildren won't be total bastards. (did ya like that one Gumby? lol)

  Slightly less creepy: Dudes! marriage feast time! That 12 year old I've been lusting after over in Betheleham just got her period!

  So vague as to be irrelevent and creepy just because it's published by the WTBTS: the NWT version
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  little witch

  LW nods in agreement. No matter how this salad is tossed, it lacks flavor! EWWWWWWW
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  peacefulpete

  I'm no greek scholar but the word strictly translated ,"virgin" is repeated in the next verse. How do these translations word the following verse? The rest of the greek seems to provide little to suggest that the man is the subject. IOW it seems to this amature that a straightforward reading favors the virgin being a woman not the man. I would enjoy reading the following verses (37-38) to see if the transaltors were consistant. I've packed away most of my transaltions.
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  True North

  peacefulpete, you can check out various translations of this at http://unbound.biola.edu/ which is the site for "The Unbound Bible". They have a search engine that covers several Bible translations.

  I'm thinking that this must be a difficult passage to translate because there is a lot of variation between translations and they tend to sound rather strained or convoluted. The best example of this is the Darby Version which renders the concluding verse for this thought, 1 Corinthians 7:38, as "So that he that marries himself does well; and he that does not marry does better."
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  peacefulpete

  It's so messy one has to wonder if the passage is either cryptic gnostic symbolism or it was touched up by later editors to alter the intepretation. Where's Narkissos?
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  aniron

  According to Strong's Greek

  Virgin in Greek is Parthenos

  and can mean

  a) a marriageable maiden

  b) a woman who has never had sexual intercourse with a man

  c) one's marriageable daughter