Communication from the subconscious

by seattleniceguy 21 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  seattleniceguy

  Hello all,
  

  It's been a while since I've posted here. Hope you all remember me!

  In the final months before I left the organization, in the days before I consciously could accept that it was not the truth - indeed, before I could even entertain such a notion on the conscious level - my subconscious knew the truth, and it took to sending me ever stronger messages. It started with a constant uneasiness in my stomach, a sort of dread, of what I did not know, or would not allow myself to consider. When I refused to listen to that, my brain upped the ante by causing on-demand sore throats.

  I knew that the symptoms were being caused by my mind because they would come on with sudden and strong intensity directly after having a doubt come into my mind. I'd be working along, and suddenly I would think, "If the flood is true, how can it be that virtually all marsupials live in Australia?" And literally within two seconds I would have a strong sore throat. My subconscious was demanding that I be honest with myself!

  Well, needless to say, that entire situation was healed overnight after I came to grips with the reality that the Watchtower was utterly out of line with rationality. One important lesson I learned - aside from the major, life-changing one - was that the subconscious often knows something that we are hiding from or supressing consciously. I became determined to be open and honest in all things, especially with myself.

  Lately, I've been feeling a similar sensation. At first it felt very similar to the gnawing uncomfortableness I felt when leaving the organization, but slightly more distant. The past few days, though, the intensity has been rising, and today the tight throat symptom was very strongly present. The strange thing in this whole matter is that this time, I don't believe I have anything to hide from. I am completely open to receiving whatever message my subconscious might be trying to send me. I've already proven I'm willing to make drastic changes in my life as necessary. What could the problem be? Let's have it out and get it over with!

  As this was beginning, I had the funny thought that perhaps one of my JW friends was currently going through the misery of learning his worldview was completely wrong, and that I was picking up resonant frequencies on the emotional subspace band. I consider myself a rationalist, and I don't actually subscribe to this concept, but I'm open to the possibility that there might be something to it. But today I think I got a clue in identifying the true cause.

  I was driving to work, listening to NPR, and I heard the article about Massachusetts legalizing gay marriage. In my view, this is definitely a step in the right direction - a step toward a more equitable society - and I applaud it. But simultaneous to my thinking this sincere thought, I noticed that I instantly imagined the critical, scornful voices of a thousand Witnesses I've known from various places and times, homogenized into a single unthinking jeer. And instantly, I had the tight, sore throat.

  Now I was able to put my finger on it. Now it was a reproducible scenario. I realized that I got the same sensation anytime I heard reasonable evidence in favor of a position scorned by Witnesses. Not only that, but I realized that I had the experience of hearing this terrible jeer on other occasions as well. Perhaps someone cut me off in traffic. Suddenly I would hear my old roommate making a caustic remark, clear anger in his words. It would seem that years of hearing the angry tone, the thinly-masked hatred of others, that the Watchtower Society sponsors, has created a reservoir in me that constantly lets me know what the party line is. It's like some kind of conscience for evil.

  But the reality is, I don't feel that way. I don't believe in putting people down. I don't believe in spewing bitter, angry words. In fact, I hate those things deeply. Perhaps this is happening out of a fear that my exposure to 25 years worth of such attitudes has tainted me, that I have been sullied somehow with the very critical attitude that I so detest. But if so, what action is my subconscious prodding me to take? In the past experience, the signal was clearly intended to make me face facts and take action. In this case, I seem to have identified the problem, but I am unable to imagine what possible action I should take.

  Can anyone identify with this? Any musings? Looking forward to hearing from you.

  Sore Throat in Seattle

  [edited to correct a typo]
• 

  Markfromcali

  My subconscious was demanding that I be honest with myself!

  The subconscious is honest and truthful, and even has integrity in a sense, but it's not necessarily smart. In other words, there is a difference between being truthful to yourself and knowing the truth of things. The subconscious just can't lie, you might say, but it can be lied to.

  In the bigger picture it just goes to show there is some separation, which is the real cause of conflict. The specific issue is not as important as the matter of unification of mind, since when that is done the answer to the particular issues will follow naturally. It's not so much a matter of facing facts, you need to face yourself. You might still have a good bottleneck with the subconscious, but just a little more bandwidth in this way may be good enough.
• 

  Corvin

  I noticed that I instantly imagined the critical, scornful voices of a thousand Witnesses I've known from various places and times, homogenized into a single unthinking jeer. And instantly, I had the tight, sore throat.

  Yes, I get that all the time and I hate it. I have to consciously tell my brain that what I just saw or heard was not evil. LOL, it is so funny sometimes, but I really do hate that conditioning we get from birth being raised a JW.
• 

  myauntfanny

  seattleniceguy

  I'm also very interested in how the subconscious sends messages, I find it very enigmatic. I think that some physical symptoms are messages, but I'm never that clear what the message is. If my throat were closing up, I might think that there was something I wanted to say but couldn't let myself. Maybe you don't want to be such a nice guy? Maybe you want to tell off some JWs?
• 

  Cicatrix

  Hi Seattle,

  I remember you. Welcome back

  I can relate very much to your experience. As I reached my breaking point a couple of years before I left, I developed a plethera of psychosomatic symptoms that grew increasingly worse over time. I had a constant low grade fever, migraines, and severe muscle pain. It gradually evolved into a total dissociation, in which I was driving down a road that I had taken thousands of times before and I had no idea where I was! I actually pulled off the road and sat for awhile, trying to remember where I was going and what I was going to do. This prompted me to take action and seek the help of a doctor, who helped me with the pain issue, and gently suggested that it may be a psychological problem that was plaguing me.

  I was in deep denial at first, but over time I began to realize that the symptoms would intensify when I went to meetings, and go away when I skipped meetings for a couple of weeks. Then, a JW friend that I trusted told me about the Silent Lambs issue, and my whole perception began to shift. When I attended my last Memorial, I had an all out panic attack, and I knew then that I could never go to another meeting at the Kingdom Hall again. At first, I told myself that it was "the people, not the religion." I thought I could remain JW, and just not go to meetings. But over a few months, I realized that it was indeed the religion. I knew I had to leave, but it scared the crap out of me to even think about it. All sorts of thoughts of raced through my head. I really felt that I was letting God down, and I feared his dissapointment more than anything else in life (a pattern I later learned, that had more to do with my relationship to my parents than anything else).

  I was a physical and emotional mess for awhile. I just couldn't deal with people-not even my own family. I spent a lot of time alone, walking and reflecting and writing in my journal.

  One day, when I was walking, I realized that I had to make an official break with the org. The idea of leaving the only belief system that I really understood was terrifying, but I knew that if things kept going as they were, the stress was going to kill me. I actually prayed a really long prayer as I walked and cried, asking for God to give me some guidance, any guidance. I started running, as if I could run away from the intense pain I was feeling. Then I had a really strange experience.

  I got a very clear picture in my mind of a young woman. She told me her name, and told me that everything was going to be okay. I am telling you-I was freaking by this point, yet somehow felt peaceful inside for the first time about my decision.

  Over a period of three days, this woman appeared in my dreams, and continued to let me know that things were going to be okay. After that, I had to deal with feelings of being "disconnected," but I no longer felt the absolute terror that I had felt before.

  At first, I thought this was something mystical, but as I look back on the experience, I believe that the woman was a manifestation of my subconscious, that helped me to be able to reason on a point that I couldn't consciously wrap my head around. The contradiction of a positive message from a Goddess figure, when I had been raised in a totally patriarchal ideology really broke through my dysfunctional belief system and made me start to think about how things really were, as opposed to what I wanted them to be. Especially since the only thing I knew about goddesses at that time was negative stuff I had heard at the meetings.

  When I officially DAd, my physical symptoms got much worse for awhile, then gradually improved. Like you, I find they return when I deal with remnants of my JW mindset. I see them as a kind of warning system now, and try to find out what the trigger is, although sometimes I can't place my finger on it.

  I've talked to people who have left other high control groups about this, and they relate the same kind of feelings-especially when they have to deal with ex-spouses and children who are still connected to the high control group, or with issues that are so contrary to their former indoctrination. The messages they give me repeatedly are: give it time-you didn't get this way overnight, continue to educate yourself, learn and practice critical thinking skills, and don't be so hard on yourself.

  It's so hard to follow their advice! I'm a perfectionist by nature, and I've always thought I was in control of my thoughts and actions, including my involvement with the JWs. Yet so many others have commented on how unaware and unsure I am of my own abilities, I realize that I still have a long way to go. I am often paralyzed with fear, unable to take action because I'm afraid my actions might hurt other people ( a fear that was drummed into me not only by the religion, but by my family), yet I have a strong need to reach out and help others. I'm just not quite sure how to do it yet.

  So I muddle on, trying to make sense of things. I'm reading lots, volunteering in the community in nonleadership roles, and doing lots of journaling. And giving it time. I was in for about twenty years. I've only been out for two, so I'm a baby yet, chronologically speaking.

  It's funny-as I looked over this before I hit the post button, I got an incredible sense of guilt. I'm not sure if what I've posted will help you or not. I feel like I'm being self-centered, writing in the first person and not giving you direct advice. So many times, I've written posts like this, then not posted them. This time, I'm going to hit the post button.

  If you get nothing else from this post-please know that you are not alone in your feelings.
• 

  Country Girl

  Cicatrix:

  Oftentimes, we help people more in a first-person narrative than we'll ever know. I find more help and comfort in people telling events and circumstances in their own lives, because it helps me to compare, evaluate, and assay my own similar situation. People take what they want or desire, and leave the rest. That's how you are helping people, at least in my opinion!

  SeattleNiceGuy:

  I have those creepy feelings, too. Although I believe strongly, and rationally, in certain principles by virtue of their being fair and equitable, I still also get those prods of the "demon religion voice" from my past, and this causes a lot of confusion in me. It mostly happens when I am in contact with JW family members or other JWs. However, this confusion produces rage because of the conflict with my knowing self, and my emotional, feeling self. I have not yet conquered this rage, but hope through time and continued reading and reasoning that this will adjust itself. I can only say that you are on the right path, and it just takes a long amount of time... you didn't get this way overnight.

  Good fortune in your journey of self discovery.

  CG
• 

  proplog2

  It was 1973. I was reading a psychology book by Perls, Hefferline & Goodman dealing with Gestalt Psychology. One of the exercises involved chewing all of your food until it was a smooth watery paste - and only then were you supposed to swallow it. The idea was to develop a resistance to just swallowing chunks. I did this for about a week and suddenly I was overcome with doubt about everything. This was the point where I started to examine the "truth" and quit swallowing things down whole. We tend to forget we are animals with a large brain on board. Our brains would like us to think we are only "brains".
• 

  Markfromcali

  Instead of this view of the subconscious communicating to the conscious, which is just a model after all, what if you simplified it as just stuff that's conscious and stuff that's not? That's not so sophisticated sounding, but it just might make more sense.

  We buy into these models of consciousness and the mind, but I say to you when you do so that itself becomes an unconscious thing, because you take that model as a given and try to fit your experience in there.

  What do you get when you are just directly experiencing, without these conceptual filters to interpret your experiences? Just an honest look, not looking for anything, but just looking to see what's there. No choosing from a list of possibilities you consider as likely, but not pushing anything away either. See it's a very natural process, so simple that anyone can do it without being told how or what to do, without believing in any way of thinking about it. It's also without outside influence in a sense, you are the only one that's doing it.

  This would be using the power of your own mind, as opposed to using or being used by ideas - which will only limit that power. Those ideas can be useful, but it's one thing to use it for everyday things, it's another to use ideas to control your mind. Ideas come from a living, dynamic mind, not the other way around. Don't let your mind be used by ideas, even if they are reasonable ones as opposed to cult mentality. Some people seem content to be used by 'good' ideas, and to each his own, but I just don't see why you'd want to. If you are more concerned with what's really going on, then you'd want to be conscious, and fancy models of mind is just a sophisticated way of going unconscious. It doesn't mean there's not an amount of relative truth to them, but seeing the truth in those models comes from the power of your consciousness - after all where did those models come from? Someone's mind!
• 

  EyeDrEvil

  Hey Seattle,

  First of all, I am still a newbie, but I still want to welcome you back to the Board. I have found it entirely therapeutic in my exit from the ''Org! I am sure you will benefit as well!

  Second of all, I thoroughly enjoyed your well-thought-out post. I could relate to much of what you were saying.

  Third of all, has to do with something you said:

  In this case, I seem to have identified the problem, but I am unable to imagine what possible action I should take.

  Take this for what it is worth. Maybe not much, as my exposure to the WT was MUCH shorter than many here on the board. BUT, my impression is that MANY or MOST coming out of the WT (myself included) have a STRONG DRIVE TO DO SOMETHING. Much like what we were pounded with from the podium at the Hall. "DO THIS. DO THAT. GET TO ALL YOUR MEETINGS. PREPARE FOR ALL YOUR MEETINGS. READ THE BIBLE (ER, WATCHTOWER PUBLICATIONS) DAILY. GO OUT IN FIELD SERVICE. KEEP UP WITH PERSONAL STUDY. GO! GO! GO! DON'T STOP! MAYBE YOU WILL BE SAVED WHEN THE BIG ONE HITS!"

  We have been ingrained with a "DO SOMETHING" mindset. However, sometimes, it is better to just sit and wait for the right opportunity / opening/ situation to arise.

  Bottom line. Don't worry about DOING SOMETHING right now. It is OK to be still for a bit. However, if there is something that strikes you as an opportunity that resonates with you, GO FOR IT! Otherwise, your actions are insincere and forced (like field service was for me)

  My 2 cents

  EyeDrEvil
• 

  itsallgoodnow

  It's our frustration over their warped, backward or supersitious thinking that annoys us more than we realize. I have that same type of thing happen, too. Like when gay couples are shown getting married and kissing each other, it's a happy occasion and you know it's great, but why does it seem strange to see them kissing? Then if you ask yourself why you get that feeling, you realize it's because you are seeing it through the hateful hypersensitive eyes of your JW family. When will that automatic response wear off? When you are so far away from it even your memory of it gets fuzzy?

  Could it be the same type of feeling as seeing things from the disgusting and annoying point of view of, for exampe, your racially prejudiced parents or grandparents? Probably most people deal with this to a degree over certain issues.