I need your help!

by open_mind 13 Replies latest jw friends

  • open_mind
    open_mind

    I have not shared my "story" with you yet.....I will give you the just of it right now, and go into further detail later.

    I was baptized three months ago. I started having doubts right away. I am currently inactive and have no plans to return. I am trying to do a slow fade because of business contacts. DF or DA would disrupt that business relationship. I will go into my doubts about the WT in a later Posting.

    Right now I need your help. I am currently studying with an elder about my doubts. We have been conversing through e-mail. This first letter is one I sent him recently. I am sorry this post is so long....

    Dear __________,

    I have not had much time to meditate on the message you sent me. I thought I would share a few responses that I do have right now, though.

    It seems that you feel I am trying to stop serving Jehovah, or that I want to leave Jehovah, and no longer have him in my life. I apologize if my actions speak this way, but that is not true. I see many benefits with having a personal relationship with god. However, we may differ on the context of that relationship, or what is required to have that relationship.

    My doubts that I am currently having are not in my relationship with Jehovah, or his Loving son Christ Jesus. I am not trying to be part of the world or desire the "flesh of the world". It seems that I have been taking information that has been handed to me for granted. I have not been researching these topics and teachings all along the way. I should have. That was my responsibility. I am the one who needs to decide if what I am told is truth or not. You said in your second letter to me, "it is a good, logical step when making decisions to consider all the factors." That is what I am doing. I appreciate the insight you have provided me. I do consider you a man with an abundance of biblical knowledge. I do not disrespect that fact. But I remember what you said last week about the historians. I asked how 600 historians could be wrong. You said that if they all used the same source, and that source was wrong, they would all be wrong. I can learn the same things you have been taught, using the same books, written by the same people, and I will know what you know. I would be very honored to have the knowledge that you have. But, I need my own knowledge. That is what this is all about. I can't believe everything that is said to me anymore without first extensively researching it. I do trust you; I know that you would never intentionally mislead me, or any one else. You have a great desire to share the truth with everyone, as I do, but I need to "make the truth my own." You said that the apostate sites (that you assume I have been visiting) are full of "empty accusations". If this is so, then what is the concern? As I have previously stated, I can no longer accept anything, FROM ANYONE, with out first researching it myself. You gave me that advice before. That is all I am trying to do now. If I were to come across an "empty accusation" from an apostate, I would have to research it to see if there is any truth. If not, then there is no concern. You asked me to come to you with any questions about things I do not understand, and I will do that.

    Brian, you cited 1 Corinthians 10:13 in your letter. The B part of that verse caught my attention, "but along with the temptation he will also make the way out in order for you to be able to endure it."

    I am not leaving Jehovah, and I have faith that he will not leave me.

    You talked about being no part of the world. Are you considering me part of the world because I have not been attending meetings? I do not feel that I am being "worldly". I have studied more in the last month than I have in the whole last year. I have read, and understood more from the bible, things I can apply to MY life, than I have in a long time. Maybe it is because I am reading from a critical point of view, I don't know. All I know right now is that I am not throwing God out of my life, and I have an incredible thirst for knowledge.

    Please know, I am not trying to do anything that would be considered as hostile towards the congregation, or any of its members. I do not desire to be disfellowshiped for any of my actions. I am just trying to resolve some concerns and questions that I have. Yet, I understand that as an elder, you have to do what you have to do. I already feel that I have been "shunned" by some for having concerns. I do not need to mention any names, but it is quite evident.

    I appreciate your insight on these issues. You have been a wonderful help to me and a wonderful friend. So many friendships are conditional these days. I just want to let you know that I value yours. I can provide more scriptural responses later. I just thought I would send this for now.

    Thank you for your help, and for being concerned about me.

    This is the response I received this morning.......

    -The email just tried to clarify a few things in our discussion..... but it would probably be nicer to talk about them in person. It seems that in email the correct feelings & intent does not always get expressed. I am hesitant to write by email... for concern of just offending you more & more. I really am not trying to do that.

    Here is one item that I made mention of:

    Regarding 1 Tim 2:5,6, the mediator. Before I can reply I need to know a few things. Do you believe that some people will live forever on the earth? Do you believe that others go to heaven to rule as kings & priests with Christ?

    As an additional point.... this whole thing has kind of shocked me. Are you willing to get together any days besides Monday for 1 hour? I will meet with your friend as well if you want.

    -Just for my peace of mind, please remember:
    I always encouraged you to be like the Beroeans in Acts Ch. 17. They checked what Paul said with the scriptures - then followed through. The Beroeans were "more noble-minded" than those in Thesolonica that just accepted every teacher that came through town. I really believed that you were checking the scriptures like the Beroeans. I would never have encouraged you to dedicate your life to Jehovah if I thought you were just following me.

    I never told you to accept it because I said so.
    I encouraged you to read the Bible.
    I encouraged you to compare Bible translations.
    I showed you EVERYTHING from the Bible.

    As I said... I am very distressed over this situation. I am very sorry if you made decisions because of following man. I truly thought that I was building you up on the foundation of Christ. (1 Cor. Ch 3)
    I did not learn what I shared with you on my own, or 'from the books I
    have'. Christs congregation taught me the truth. Again.. for my peace of mind. If the above statement is not true, please let
    me know. I am in anguish about this situation.

    For my understanding please let me know how you feel about the following doctrinal teachings of Jehovah's Witnesses:

    1) No Trinity
    2) No immortal soul
    3) No eternal torment
    4) No predestination
    5) God's name is Jehovah
    6) Christ is the head of a unified Christian Congregation
    7) God's Kingdom is a heavenly government
    8) Christ is overseeing the global preaching work for a witness to all
    nations before the end comes

    Now.... I am not asking this to offend you. If you still hold to these Bible truths, GREAT! If you do.... then please have appreciation for the global organization that Jehovah is using to teach mankind these truths.. freeing them from Babylonish captivity. There does not exist another global educational program like ours that brings these teachings to mankind. Do you still agree with this?
    If you disagree with any of these teachings, then we could review them if you want to.

    Sincerely,
    _________

    It is obvious that he did not read my letter nery closely, but any input you would have would be wonderful.

    Please note, I have no desire to be a JW anymore.

    Open_Mind

  • outnfree
    outnfree

    Dear Open_Mind,

    I would suggest that if you are working for/with Witnesses that you start a job search right now. Almost anything you reply to this elder, if honest, will tip him off that you "no longer want to be a JW." You can probably stall him a short while longer, because he obviously cares for you and would take the time to try to resolve your doubts about any of the points he particularly highlighted.

    If you have a business contract with JWs, they will honor it even if you are DA'd or DF'd because it is a legal obligation. But you will receive no further business from them.

    I'm really sorry for your situation. And I wish you spiritual peace.

    outnfree

  • expatbrit
    expatbrit

    Open_Mind:

    The following is merely my opinion:

    Do not reply to this e-mail. Do not consent to see or speak to this elder. Do not answer his questions.

    The reason I say this? It appears obvious that the elder has gone into damage control mode. His e-mail is peppered with questions that all elders ask when they are trying to back you into a corner for easy containment and disposal. Answering any of these questions with your true feelings will automatically lead to disfellowshiping and shunning, with immediate negative impact upon your business interests.

    Also, I'm sorry to say, I wouldn't give too much credence to his protestations of anguish. From my experience as a JW, if a study or freshly baptized person "goes astray", they are written off very quickly with few feelings of sadness. Remember that the only thing most JW "frienships" are founded on is their membership of the WT. Once this no longer applies, any "friendship" becomes null and void.

    In your situation, I would attempt to stall for time. Claim a busy schedule, ill health, whatever. In the gained time, make altering your business interests your top priority. See a lawyer regarding existing contracts with JW's. Once business is no longer a factor, you have more options (I don't know if you have family members in the WT).

    I hope that things work out. Let us know how it goes.

    And welcome to the board.

    Expatbrit

  • God_knows
    God_knows

    Peace and love to you, OPENMIND

    Listen, I never was a JW, but I'd reallyl ike to be there to help you if I can. Especially if you have any bible questions in particular. I do not pretend to be a genius, But, you know, write to me anytime, and I will be there. Even if you just need a friend. I would like to be there for you.

    [email protected]

  • SixofNine
    SixofNine

    I read this earlier, then re-read it after reading expat's reply to you.

    I agree with him. This elder has already switched out of friendship mode.

    The way you answer those questions tells him if you are worthy of life on this planet, to his mind.

    Sad.

  • Francois
    Francois

    If it's true that you have no desire to be a JW any more, what else do you need to know?

    If you pretend to remain in the organization due to business considerations, well...

    Francois

    My $0.02

  • Cautious
    Cautious

    I agree with the other posts Open_Mind. The elder seems to be backing you into a corner. They are good at that.

    I don't know what type of business you are in, but I would try to establish different contacts if I were you, or get another job. Either that, or pretend that you have not doubts anymore and then slowly fade, after a period of "doing the right thing".

    Please let us know how it goes.

    And, on a more cheerful note - welcome

  • Roamingfeline
    Roamingfeline

    Open_Mind, this elder is very sneaky. VERY SNEAKY. Those are the standard questions elders are to ask when they're putting you into DF mode. He is trying to trick you right into a judicial committee situation, that is very apparent.

    Don't fall for it. Don't meet with him under any circumstances, and I would put nothing more in writing to him regarding his questions.

    Good luck,
    RCat

  • messenger
    messenger

    you are playing with a snake, he may not bite you, then again he may not be able to overcome his nature. if you think you can take the bite, then play the game. if not, you better distance yourself from this situation.

  • esther
    esther

    Open_mind, I agree with the answers you have so far received. Especially do not put anything in writing and don't talk to an elder at all. Remember, even if he is your friend, he is an elder first, and as such, he puts the organisation above everything.

    If you need to keep up the business with JWs, one way is to follow expatbrit's advice

    attempt to stall for time. Claim a busy schedule, ill health, whatever. In the gained time, make altering your business interests your top priority. See a lawyer regarding existing contracts with JW's. Once business is no longer a factor, you have more options
    is good.

    Or you could follow the advice of Cautious

    pretend that you have not doubts anymore and then slowly fade, after a period of "doing the right thing"
    .

    I hope everything works out for you

    esther

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