Who's rights prevail?

by Thunder Rider 30 Replies latest social current

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  SixofNine

  :".. how are we supposed to change the way we treat criminals without involving the government?"
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
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  SheilaM

  Glad our forefathers didn't feel this way.....hmmmm
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  freedom96

  I can't help but feel that this dad gave up all rights when he decided not to cooperate with the authorities. Clearly, he was the last one with the kids, and if he didn't have anything to hide, then he would help the authorities in every way shape or form.

  But he is not helping, and has something to hide.

  I am not suggesting torturing every criminal or potential criminal. Case by case basis. But, in this case, we have a uncooperative parent, and those kids need to be found. Hopefully alive, but if not, they still need to be found.

  I will add one more thing.

  Lets say the father talks, and the kids are found dead. I would have no problem whatsoever letting the mother do to the father whatever it was that killed the kids. For example, if he drowned them, then let the mom drown the father, if she so choses. If he stabbed the poor kids, then let the mom stab the father, if she so choses. For those yelling about rights, ok, let him be found guilty first, then let her do it.

  How can we be so worried about an asshole parents rights when it looks like he did in his own kids? Anyone who is capable of that, in my opinion, deserves no rights.

  Kill the bastard...... long and torturous.
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  Corvin

  Why are they not beating the $#!^ out of him? Do his civil rights outweigh the childrens needs or the mothers needs?

  Honest to god! In such cases, sodium pentathol should be forceably used on sons of bitch's like this guy.

  Corvin
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  Thunder Rider

  I'm thinking that the human spirit should rise above the law and we might try doing the right thing in such cases for a change.
  Sixy, I don't mean to step on your toes. I'm glad there people like you around to keep things in perspective. I do feel though that the justice system yeilds too much to the rights of the accused and is oft unfare to the victim. Perhaps he did steal the children away and they are in hiding because they were in an abusive situation with their mother, though nothing like that has been offered up by him or the authorities.
  
  Freedom, Corvin,
  I'm with you on this one. There was just a spot on America's Most Wanted featuring the faces of the kids and the fact that they were still missing. It is feared that they have been drowned. As barbaric as some might think, should it be found so I believe the just thing would be to sink his sorry ass in the same spot they were left. What fear have men like this to ponder when their treatment by the authorities after the comission of the crime is so diametricaly opposite the way they treated their victim or in this case victims? If he had a beef with his ex-wife, that is one thing but to take it out on the children shows the depth of depravity that he has chosen to sink to.
  
  Chosen is the key word there. He made his choice to step out of the bounds of civil human behavior and therefor in my opinion has forfiet his rights to be treated civily. It is the same justice system that sets the bounds of civil behavior, everything from taking of lives to cussing in public. Why in the long term does it seem that the system works only for those that can affort to manipulate or abuse it? Those babies had no choice in the matter. The court mandated visitation and if the mom had refused then she would have been in dutch. Instead now she stands at a candlelight vigil praying for the safe return of her boy and girl while her ex-husband sits in jail refusing to assist the police in the search for his own kids. Should they be found alive he will probably get some prison time where he can have his teeth fixed, sculpt his body, get his degree and write a book or sell his story to hollywood. Should they be found dead, his situation will not be much different and the family will be left devistated and distraught. Where is the justice in that?
  
  I'll be the first to admit that my values are very conservative. I also admit to having a bit of a god complex, but only because god has chosen to drop the ball. For a group of cult survivors and abuse survivors, I would think we might be more understanding of the needs of the victims of such crimes and manipulations. We have a great bunch of folks here, many different voices, many different ideals. I think we can all agree that what Porter is doing is wrong, whether he kidnapped and murdered the children or he kidnapped and hid them away for their own safety. The former is worthy death the latter of understanding, but with acceptance that it wasn't handled properly. I only pray that they are brough thome safely and soon.
  
  Thunder ==}>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
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  Valis

  Where are the children's rights in these bitter divorces? That's my question.

  This is IMO the most pertinent question in all of this whole stupid thread where my friends are insulting each other. . If a family desolves and the parent's relationship is very volatile the children should be removed period. We can talk about father's and mother's rights all we want, but it boils down to children being in the line of fire or not. Sometimes people act very stupid and parents antagonize each other to the point of violence, harsh words, and even worse. People are evil and children pay for it.

  I am not willing to advocate physically violent interrogation, unless of course it could be determined the man had indeed injured the children. It would ruin any leagl prceeding against him, which is very important to consider in the midst of all the emotion. . I for one would be willing to hide my kids and go to jail if I thought it were in thier best interest. It would have to be a terrible extreme, but don't think for a minute I wouldn't. This is not an easy subject for parents to discuss, because of it's very nature..that being the drawn out protective nature that gets tangled many times with the reality of law.

  Sincerely,

  District Overbeer
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  SixofNine

  :I only pray that they are brough thome safely and soon.
  
  
  
  
  
  
  Wish there was a god.
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  talesin

  YES, Thunder. Well said.

  And you said this,

  Why in the long term does it seem that the system works only for those that can affort to manipulate or abuse it?

  That is too true, and very sad. (I speak as a Canadian, for it is no different here.) Perhaps each of us can advocate for one person, or write one letter, or cast one vote, that will make a difference in changing this reality of our society.

  It's hard when something like this happens so close to home, isn't it? I felt the same way a couple of weeks ago, when there was a hostage-taking on my street. I know that the two of you probably will not rest well until this is resolved.

  Would it be out of place for me to ask all who are sharing this story to send their thoughts and prayers for these children's safety? I truly believe it can help. Perhaps we can all take a moment to do this.

  We must not let cynicism and weariness at the injustices perpetrated in our society get us down. Altruism does exist; it is alive and well here, at JWD.

  tal
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  SheilaM

  One note the "Father" of the children called the Mom the night he was supposed to return them and told her she would never see them again. He seems to be using the kids as pawns because of his hatred of the Mother, no one has speculated that the children were "hid" for protection. I am just so sick of children bearing the brunt of adults gone wild:( Ya know Love you too Valis
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  SixofNine

  We had a case here in Dallas about 3 or 4 years ago, where this worthless piece of shit masquarading as a human called his ex on the phone, so she could listen as he took a shotgun and shot their two beautiful daughters. He too had a long history of abusing and control issues with the women in his life (though he'd never been abusive to his kids).