This is an email that was sent to me from a dear freind who I sent some information on mind control. I known him for about 30 yrs.we were good friends, he still is a JW even after experiencing a lot of injustice from the elders. He a very nice person.
Please tell let me know what you think of his email refutation.
Thought Reform
David, even Jehovah uses Thought Reform. He uses it for good ON HIMSELF to keep to righteousness. Look at Eph 6:4 AND BE VERY CAREFUL HOW YOU INTERPRET THESE WORDS....And YOU, fathers, do not be irritating YOUR children, but go on bringing them up in the discipline and mental-regulating of Jehovah. I warned you to be careful. Let's examine those words very carefully. It is so important. In the preceding verses, Jehovah advises us to live and enjoy life by (that is, only by) following righteous guidelines that guide our thinking and thus govern our conduct. He first advises husbands and wives --NOT how to act-- but how to think of each other, to best encourage care and love for each other. Then he advises children how to consider their parents -- and why so -- because it will work out for their own best good: That it may go well with you and you may endure a long time on the earth. Lastly he advises parents to teach, INSTRUCT (not force) their children in righteousness so that loving parents will be preparing the children to live a good, righteous life. IN ALL THE PRECEDING verses God lovingly encourages (not forces) us to consider forming our mental attitude so that it motivates us to conduct that benefits everyone -- our loving partners, our parents and our children -- and thus our own happiness and comfort. HE NEVER EVEN MENTIONED FORCING ANYONE TO DO ANYTHING. Therefore bringing children up "in the discipline and mental-regulating of Jehovah" is not forcing their minds by mind control -- look how simple it is -- he is saying to teach them the way to control themselves THE SAME WAY JEHOVAH CONTROLS HIMSELF -- THE DISCIPLINE AND MIND-CONTROL THAT JEHOVAH USES ON HIMSELF -- THE MIND-CONTROL OF (I.E. BY, USED BY) JEHOVAH. He directs his purpose and actions by considering the principles, Nowhere is there a suggestion that we should CONTROL the minds of our kids. We are teaching them, giving them guidance, not rules.
The whole point here is that mental control and discipline is not necessarily bad. Jehovah uses it -- ON HIMSELF. Get the point?
To control hims Dr. Robert J. Lifton's Criteria for Thought Reform
Who is Mr. Lifton? What was his purpose in writing this? Is he a deprogrammer? Let me ask you as a parent this question: Is it a good thing to take a righteously inclined child and deprogram -remove- those motivations so that the child operates with total freedom? Anyone totally free of all restrictions can raise up hate, fear in others and destruction without limit. That is BAD !! Principles are necessary to live happy lives. I ask you again, what is the goal of this author? In deprogramming people he is actually forcing HIS programming into them -- or else he is taking everything from them and then leaving them with NOTHING.
I didn't say, "Ignore his thoughts." or "He is wrong." I am saying "Be careful to understand his aims, be careful to use his insight properly."
Any ideology -- that is, any set of emotionally-charged convictions about men and his relationship to the natural or supernatural world -- may be carried by its adherents in a totalistic direction. But this is most likely to occur with those ideologies which are most sweeping in their content and most ambitious or messianic in their claim, whether a religious or political organization. And where totalism exists, a religion, or a political movement becomes little more than an exclusive cult.
Right as rain. Now tell me, how does one evaluate whether a cult is adding value or subtracting value from humanity ... and ... how do you tell if a cult is the truth?
You can tell by it's results and by its proofs. Dave, has Jehovah's Witnesses society proved itself by what it teaches, to love man and God and wife and child and to act for the betterment of all? Hasn't the history and goals of the society PROVED that Jehovah is behind it? Doesn't the society strain to keep to fairness, honesty, goodness AND adhere as best as possible to Jah's Bible?
Besides, there is one small semantic error here I have to correct. We are not a cult because, by the English definition of the word 'cult', that is a group that follows one man, a leader. Can you answer which single man is the leader of the Witnesses? No? Not exactly? Then technically we are not a cult.
Here you will find a set of criteria, eight psychological themes against which any environment may be judged. In combination, they create an atmosphere which may temporarily energize or exhilarate, but which at the same time pose the gravest of human threats.
What is the "'gravest of human threats" that the society presents to the world. Is it that we will live in peace in perfect health and happiness forever? That we should love one another and take care of each other and forgive each other? That we have the obligation to invite everyone to enjoy those terrible evils? Perhaps the threat is that mankind should be free of crime, disease, hunger, suffering, death, old age, poverty, hate and war. You have to judge a tree by it's fruits.
(a brief outline)
MILIEU CONTROL
David, dear brother. Many of these concepts listed below are not the characteristics of control in a cult per se (by itself), they are plain good principles used in everyday life to keep things proper and safe. Example: A (good) policeman ENFORCES the law; he insures peace. He is not a Nazi controller trained to force humanity to strictly obey every decree of the totalitarian overlords. Come on, guy. Get real. Use some common sense. Yes, these are 'cult' characteristics, but not solely 'cult'. They are not necessarily evil. You and Marion used some of them to help raise Spencer an Lotus to become good people.
The most basic feature is the control of human communication within an environment
Ok, so? Entertaining and spreading bad thoughts often inflames bad desires that, when they are acted upon, ruin things for all of us. Is it bad to require members not to swear, state immoral or deadly intentions, to spread hate, to be sexually suggestive, to speak in a way that glorifies immorality, crime or making others suffer?
If the control is extremely intense, it becomes internalized control -- an attempt to manage an individual's inner communication
Tell me you never disciplined Lotus or Spencer by some punishment. Did that make you evil? Is your family a 'cult'?
Control over all a person sees, hears, reads, writes (information control) creates conflicts in respect to individual autonomy
Control? Does the society 'control' us -- no. We are able to do as we please. The society only ADVISES us and encourages us. On the other hand, we don't 'control' the society either. They have the right to say "He's not one of us." It's only fair. Use your noggin. The Jamestown suicide was a CONTROLLED community. They drank the cyanide-Kool-Aid AT GUNPOINT. The vast tropical forest insured no escape from the camp. The society does NOT control us !!!! We don't live in communes.
Groups express this in several ways: Group process, isolation from other people, psychological pressure, geographical distance or unavailable transportation, sometimes physical pressure
Which one of these ways mentioned does the society use? NONE. Look, we are in the world, work in it, live in it, go out in service in it, visit our worldly family members in it, LIVE in it, etc. Where are we prevented, physically prevented and isolated? Where, David, where?
Often a sequence of events, such as seminars, lectures, group encounters, which become increasingly intense and increasingly isolated, making it extremely difficult-- both physically and psychologically--for one to leave
Increasingly intense? Increasingly isolated? Extremely difficult physically (and psychologically) for one to leave? David, what are you thinking. People walk out of the truth each day. Once you leave, nobody bothers you anymore. Just say, "I want out." and GO. Are you even thinking in any way that this stuff applies to the society? Just what are you trying to say in sending me this as an explanation of your stand?
Sets up a sense of antagonism with the outside world; it's "us against them"
Big bionic deal. When isn't it us vs. them in ANYTHING, cult or not. This item is garbage.
Closely connected to the process of individual change (of personality)
Genius! Genius! Why in heck do people join anything? TO IMPROVE! The contention of any organization is improvement -- knowledge (schools,college), money (your job, knucklehead), body form (exercise shops), entertainment (movies, camping, beach clubs). An organization that claims to teach one what God wants can do nothing but encourage 'the process of individual change (of personality)" This isn't brain surgery. This author is an idiot.
MYSTICAL MANIPULATION (Planned spontaneity)
Extensive personal manipulation
Another word for that is personal attention. Loving concern and aid. One on one guidance. Making sure the knowledge is understood. (I didn't say forced. First you learn, then you know, THEN and only then can you make a considered decision.)
Seeks to promote specific patterns of behavior and emotion in such a way that it appears to have arisen spontaneously from within the environment, while it actually has been orchestrated
If he means that the knowledge one gains should motivate him to act accordingly, he's right on the money. Look, knucklehead, the purpose of knowledge is to impart to a person the ability to USE that knowledge for a purpose. No change means a useless work.
Totalist leaders claim to be agents chosen by God, history, or some supernatural force, to carry out the mystical imperative
Who is our totalist leader? What man? Russell? Knorr? Freund? Hershel? Heck, I'll bet most witnesses don't even know the name of our current president. Maybe this applies to the anointed 'mystic leaders'. Yeah. All 8000 of them.
The "principles" (God-centered or otherwise) can be put forcibly and claimed exclusively, so that the cult and its beliefs become the only true path to salvation (or enlightenment)
But use common sense. If there is a true path, then IT IS THE TRUE PATH. How can one argue with truth and win? You CAN win if the truth isn't really truth. Now tell me, what aspect of the truth is wrong and prove it.
The individual then develops the psychology of the pawn, and participates actively in the manipulation of others
Do we individual witnesses act like 'pawns'? Does Jehovah give us hard and fast RULES which we have to obey exactly -- or does he give us broad principles (and explains the important reasons for those principles) and then sets us free to use our own talent and ability and decisions. Knowing that we should go door to door and why we should is NOT forcing us to go. The elders do not "FORCE" us to sit quietly at each meeting. That is a politeness we adhere to IF we what to learn. Nobody forces anybody in the truth. Want to leave? Go! Many people do. It's your free choice. But if you love righteousness and God and truth, THOSE elements will force you to stay. Not the society.
The leader who becomes the center of the mystical manipulation (or the person in whose name it is done) can be sometimes more real than an abstract god and therefore attractive to cult members
What ? What leader? Who?
Legitimizes the deception used to recruit new members and/or raise funds, and the deception used on the "outside world"
Deception? No, I have never found any here inside. I have found that, as the society honestly warned me, that all men are imperfect and sometimes it shows up at critical times. They also showed me two ways of dealing with it. Lovingly and angrily. I have my own choice. Isn't it better to act lovingly and thereby participate in trying to help the person making errors. He usually won't recognize your love for decades. But then...But, "if your enemy is hungry, feed him; if he is thirsty, give him something to drink; for by doing this you will heap fiery coals upon his head." Do not let yourself be conquered by the evil, but keep conquering the evil with the good (Rom 12:20-21)
THE DEMAND FOR PURITY
The world becomes sharply divided into the pure and the impure, the absolutely good (the group/ideology) and the absolutely evil (everything outside the group)
Yep. everything is in black and white now. World bad, us good. That's why newcomers NEVER have a lick of trouble understanding how good people that would never steal, kill, swear -- do anything wrong -- may not make it through. Black and white my bionic foot!
One must continually change or conform to the group "norm"
NO! One must continue to work on himself. The 'norm' here NEVER changes.
Tendencies towards guilt and shame are used as emotional levers for the group's controlling and manipulative influences
Psychologists use this to probe their patients. Parents use it to help instruct their children ("You did WHAT? HOW could you? I raised you better than that! Say you are sorry! NOW!!") Is this author saying that my mom was a bad person, a cult leader ??
Once a person has experienced the totalist polarization of good/evil (black/white thinking), he has great difficulty in regaining a more balanced inner sensitivity to the complexities of human morality
Per earlier, we don't see polarized black and white. The society constantly teaches us to maintain a balance. The society teaches us to have empathy and understanding for others, even people in the world and especially those we see door to door and our families and business acquaintances so that we always leave a good taste.. This line item doesn't apply to us either.
The radical separation of pure/impure is both within the environment (the group) and the individual
Run that one by me again in English,please.
Ties in with the process of confession -- one must confess when one is not conforming
TO HIMSELF, then to God. We don't run to the elders for absolution.
CONFESSION
Cultic confession is carried beyond its ordinary religious, legal and therapeutic expressions to the point of becoming a cult in itself
Do you think that applies to our society? Do any of these line items? I don't think so. Not one of them. We don't do confessions.
Sessions in which one confesses to one's sin are accompanied by patterns of criticism and self-criticism, generally transpiring within small groups with an active and dynamic thrust toward personal change
Is an act of symbolic self-surrender
Makes it virtually impossible to attain a reasonable balance between worth and humility
A person confessing to various sins of pre-cultic existence can both believe in those sins and be covering over other ideas and feelings that s/he is either unaware of or reluctant to discuss
Often a person will confess to lesser sins while holding on to other secrets (often criticisms/questions/doubts about the group/leaders that may cause them not to advance to a leadership position)
"The more I accuse myself, the more I have a right to judge you"
SACRED SCIENCE
The totalist milieu maintains an aura of sacredness around its basic doctrine or ideology, holding it as an ultimate moral vision for the ordering of human existence
Isn't that the vanilla definition of an ideology? This guy is giving us reasoning that goes round in a circle
Questioning or criticizing those basic assumptions is prohibited
Questioning, no. BUT NOTICE that questioning also means getting an answer. It doesn't mean an instant answer. Jehovah answers all in HIS time. Haven't your past questions been answered --- and if the questions you have now aren't answered right away, will someone die -- or is it more intelligent to keep the question quietly alive and observe what Jah does? Are you impatient? Remember, Jehovah painfully tolerated his creation to be subjected to evil for 60 centuries. Moreover, he underwent the searing pain of having to allow his precious son to be tortured by tiny ants he could crush in an instant -- so that some could be rescued. He allowed for questions to be answered -- over 60 centuries. Are you so impatient?
A reverence is demanded for the ideology/doctrine, the originators of the ideology/doctrine, the present bearers of the ideology/doctrine
Oh yeah. Remember and revere Saint Russell. And Pope Knorr the first. Any other comment?
Offers considerable security to young people because it greatly simplifies the world and answers a contemporary need to combine a sacred set of dogmatic principles with a claim to a science embodying the truth about human behavior and human psychology
Did you ever notice that the truth is ONLY young kids? No grownups at all!! Only the elders are old. Get a life!
LOADING THE LANGUAGE
The language of the totalist environment is characterized by the thought-terminating cliche (thought-stoppers)
Repetitiously centered on all-encompassing jargon
"The language of non-thought"
Words are given new meanings -- the outside world does not use the words or phrases in the same way -- it becomes a "group" word or phrase
He's right. We have words for "don't-calls", sheep, lamb, pioneer, Bethel, etc. In fact, my engineering degree, by this guy's definition is a cult certificate. We say capacitor, induction, Faraday effect, Miller effect, feedback loop, oscilloscope, tank circuit, and on and on. We electrical engineers are a cult ! Holy cow!
NO! Words represent concepts. We witnesses deal with concepts that the general world isn't interested in. Yes we have a jargon. It's verbal short cuts, but it is not thought-stopping.
DOCTRINE OVER PERSON
Every issue in one's life can be reduced to a single set of principles that have an inner coherence to the point that one can claim the experience of truth and feel it
Huh? No!
The pattern of doctrine over person occurs when there is a conflict between what one feels oneself experiencing and what the doctrine or ideology says one should experience
Nope again. I say that based on 27 YEARS of experiencing the reverse.
If one questions the beliefs of the group or the leaders of the group, one is made to feel that there is something inherently wrong with them to even question -- it is always "turned around" on them and the questioner/criticizer is questioned rather than the questions answered directly
YES, YES, YES and especially so when the teacher is egotistical and stupid. Most of the other members I have found are eager to help find an answer. The only problem is when the questioner will not accept a valid answer because he will have to give in a point -- or when the questioner never WANTS to hear the answer -- or when the answer is exactly what he wanted to hear and yet the condition is not immediately improved and he exalted for explaining the problem. WAIT ON JEHOVAH. Is the God who created the stars and the heavens of the heavens so weak and/or uninterested that he will let his system crumble and people DIE because of some small error?
The underlying assumption is that doctrine/ideology is ultimately more valid, true and real than any aspect of actual human character or human experience and one must subject one's experience to that "truth"
Quote: "If you don't believe me, believe my miracles." Now tell me what doctrine is more real than his miracles?
The experience of contradiction can be immediately associated with guilt
Who is teaching that?
One is made to feel that doubts are reflections of one's own evil
Doubts are a reflection of either a lack of knowledge or of a person's decision to want the pleasures obtainable by not following the principles. One's heart can lead the brain -- and beware, the heart is treacherous !
When doubt arises, conflicts become intense
When doubt arises, there is no conflict. IN that case we seek knowledge to eliminate or explain away the doubt.
Dave , I have to quit here. I can't take any more of this garbage. I just cannot see how in tarnation it applies to the proper conduct of the truth. Oh, sure, there are men in the truth who are not conducting themselves properly. These should be forgiven and lovingly encouraged. They will decide their own fate. You, you David Wiltshire, have been instructed far more than most of us and have seen both good and bad operate in this organization -- and I am sure have witnessed the results.
If what you have found, Jehovah agrees with, but Jehovah allows to continue, stand back and watch. If Jehovah disagrees, you had better stand back anyway. The real truth organization runs not on knowledge and law and principle and ideology, it runs on LOVE. It is not love to yell others are making mistakes and slap them silly. It is love to be patient. It is even more than love to accept hurt and allow wrong when we are not the ones authorized to correct it.
Jehovah God put many different psychological processes into us humans. He designed them in -- that they will operate in a perfect world for our benefit. Now this isn't a perfect world. True CULT leaders CAN take advantage of these psychological mechanisms for their own advantage. That doesn't mean those psych. mechanisms are inherently BAD. It means only that evil people can and do misuse them. God CAN RIGHTEOUSLY use them for our good.
Look, your boss would be dead wrong if he slapped your face at work in order to settle a disagreement about work. On the other hand, a parent can properly slap a misbehaving 2-year old whining child.
Just because an effect, a technique exists and is used by evil men, does not condemn the effect or technique AND does not mean God cannot use it properly.
PLEASE BE CAREFUL
DISPENSING OF EXISTENCE
Since the group has an absolute or totalist vision of truth, those who are not in the group are bound up in evil, are not enlightened, are not saved, and do not have the right to exist
"Being verses nothingness"
Impediments to legitimate being must be pushed away or destroyed
One outside the group may always receive their right of existence by joining the group
Fear manipulation -- if one leaves this group, one leaves God or loses their transformation, for something bad will happen to them
The group is the "elite", outsiders are "of the world", "evil", "unenlightened", etc.