| ...................................But Moses said to them: "Why are you quarreling with me? Why do you keep putting JEHOVAH to the test?"...............................................................................................................................So he called the name of the place Massah and Meribah, because of their putting JEHOVAH to the test, saying; "Is JEHOVAH in our midst or not?" Ex. 17:1-7(NWT) The Israelitess put Jehovah God to the test at a place that Moses named Massah and Meribah. This is also described by the Psalmist: O come in, let us worship and bow down; let us kneel before JEHOVAH our MAker. For HE IS OUR GOD ........................ as in the day of Massah in the wilderness, WHEN YOUR FOREFATHERS PUT ME TO THE PROOF; they examined me, THEY ALSO SAW my ACTIVITY.................................................................................................".....and they themselves have not come to know MY WAYS" concerning whom I swore in my anger: "They shall not enter into MY RESTING PLACE." Psalm 95:6-11(NWT) To a new generation of Israelites about to enter the promised land, Moses said: "You must not put JEHOVAH YOUR GOD TO THE TEST, the way you put him to the test at Massah." Deut. 6:16(NWT) Of Whom did they make a test? Jehovah God. Whose ways have they not come to know? Jehovah God`s ways. Whose rest shall that generation not enter? Jehovah God`s rest. Let us now prayerfully consider what light the inspired book of Hebrews sheds on the subject "For this reason, just* AS THE HOLY SPIRIT SAYS: "Today if you people listen tohis own voice, do not harden your hearts as on the occasion of causing bitter anger, as in the day of making the test in the wilderness, IN WHICH YOUR FOREFATHERS MADE A TEST OF ME with a trial, and yet THEY HAD SEEN MY WORKS for fourty years. For this reason I became disgusted with this generation and said: 'They always go astray in their hearts, and they themselves have not come to know MY WAYS.' So I swore in my anger, 'They shall not enter into MY REST.'" Hebrews 3:7-11(NWT) * The word "just" shouldn`t be there, acc. to the Diaglott. Let us pause for a moment to consider the context. The Holy Spirit is telling us not to harden our hearts in unbelief when we hear the words of Christ. He cites the example of the Israelites. Even tho they were delivered with a mighty hand out of Egypt with mighty signs and wonders, yet they failed to enter the promised land. Instead, they perished in the wilderness because of unbelief and disobedience. If they failed because they were disobedient to the Word that Moses spoke to them, what hope is there for those who are disobedient to the Word that the Son of God speaks to us today? There`s another lesson to be learned, as well. Acc. to Heb. 3:7, WHO is speaking? The Holy Spirit. And of WHOM does He say the Israelites made a test? Of Himself--the SAME Holy Spirit. Whose ways did they not come to know? The Holy Spirit`s ways. and WHOSE rest did that generation not enter? The Holy Spirit`s rest. The Holy Spirit IS Jehovah God..........................:=))) |
WHOM did Israel put to the test when they tested Jehovah?
by Tyre 12 Replies latest watchtower bible
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Tyre
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Tyre
I dunno why the text become smaller!!!
...................................But Moses said to them: "Why are you quarreling with me? Why do you keep putting JEHOVAH to the test?"...............................................................................................................................So he called the name of the place Massah and Meribah, because of their putting JEHOVAH to the test, saying; "Is JEHOVAH in our midst or not?" Ex. 17:1-7(NWT)
The Israelitess put Jehovah God to the test at a place that Moses named Massah and Meribah. This is also described by the Psalmist:
O come in, let us worship and bow down; let us kneel before JEHOVAH our MAker. For HE IS OUR GOD ........................ as in the day of Massah in the wilderness, WHEN YOUR FOREFATHERS PUT ME TO THE PROOF; they examined me, THEY ALSO SAW my ACTIVITY.................................................................................................".....and they themselves have not come to know MY WAYS" concerning whom I swore in my anger: "They shall not enter into MY RESTING PLACE." Psalm 95:6-11(NWT)
To a new generation of Israelites about to enter the promised land, Moses said:
"You must not put JEHOVAH YOUR GOD TO THE TEST, the way you put him to the test at Massah." Deut. 6:16(NWT)
Of Whom did they make a test? Jehovah God. Whose ways have they not come to know? Jehovah God`s ways. Whose rest shall that generation not enter? Jehovah God`s rest. Let us now prayerfully consider what light the inspired book of Hebrews sheds on the subject "For this reason, just* AS THE HOLY SPIRIT SAYS: "Today if you people listen tohis own voice, do not harden your hearts as on the occasion of causing bitter anger, as in the day of making the test in the wilderness, IN WHICH YOUR FOREFATHERS MADE A TEST OF ME with a trial, and yet THEY HAD SEEN MY WORKS for fourty years. For this reason I became disgusted with this generation and said: 'They always go astray in their hearts, and they themselves have not come to know MY WAYS.' So I swore in my anger, 'They shall not enter into MY REST.'" Hebrews 3:7-11(NWT)
* The word "just" shouldn`t be there, acc. to the Diaglott. Let us pause for a moment to consider the context. The Holy Spirit is telling us not to harden our hearts in unbelief when we hear the words of Christ. He cites the example of the Israelites. Even tho they were delivered with a mighty hand out of Egypt with mighty signs and wonders, yet they failed to enter the promised land. Instead, they perished in the wilderness because of unbelief and disobedience. If they failed because they were disobedient to the Word that Moses spoke to them, what hope is there for those who are disobedient to the Word that the Son of God speaks to us today? There`s another lesson to be learned, as well. Acc. to Heb. 3:7,
WHO is speaking? The Holy Spirit. And of WHOM does He say the Israelites made a test? Of Himself--the SAME Holy Spirit. Whose ways did they not come to know? The Holy Spirit`s ways. and WHOSE rest did that generation not enter? The Holy Spirit`s rest.
The Holy Spirit IS Jehovah God..........................:=)))
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in a new york bethel minute
i like your posts tyre. easy to read and spiritually upbuilding. being raised a witness myself, i still feel a little uncomfortable praying to jesus... but what about praying to the Holy Spirit? is that allowed by trinitarians? i have never heard anyone do it. do you have any scriptures or angles that could shed light on this subject? thank you in advance for your reply
bethelight
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peacefulpete
There have been fine threads that dealt with the evolution of the trinitarian conceptualization of the holy spirit. Here's one by Leolaia.The Holy Spirit
Tyre of course knows of this thread because she posted a cut and paste trinity website on the thread without addressing anything the threads creator commented upon.
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UnDisfellowshipped
In a New York Bethel Minute said:
being raised a witness myself, i still feel a little uncomfortable praying to jesus... but what about praying to the Holy Spirit? is that allowed by trinitarians? i have never heard anyone do it. do you have any scriptures or angles that could shed light on this subject? thank you in advance for your reply
Praying to Jesus is such a wonderful experience.
The JW's are forbidden from doing so, even though Stephen, and the Apostle Paul, Apostle John, and Apostle Peter (among others) all prayed to Jesus, worshiped Jesus as God, and proclaimed Jesus as The Creator.
As for praying to The Holy Spirit -- yes, by all means Trinitarians pray to The Spirit, and The Father, and The Son!
The Holy Spirit is 100% God, just as much as The Father and The Son.
The Spirit deserves all of the honor, glory, and praise that God The Father and Jesus Christ deserve.
The Apostle Paul, in the Holy Bible, did indeed pray to The Holy Spirit:
2nd Thessalonians 3:5: And the Lord direct your hearts into the love of God, and into the patient waiting for Christ.
"The Lord" in that Verse is distinguished from God and from Christ.
2nd Corinthians 13:14: The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Spirit, [be] with you all. Amen.
Paul prayed to The Holy Trinity in that Verse.
Also, the Apostle John prayed to the "Seven Spirits" (which is The Holy Spirit):
Revelation 1:4-5: John to the seven churches which are in Asia: Grace [be] to you, and peace, from him which is, and which was, and which is to come; and from the seven Spirits which are before his throne; And from Jesus Christ, [who is] the faithful witness, [and] the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. To him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood
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Tyre
i like your posts tyre. easy to read and spiritually upbuilding. being raised a witness myself, i still feel a little uncomfortable praying to jesus... but what about praying to the Holy Spirit? is that allowed by trinitarians? i have never heard anyone do it. do you have any scriptures or angles that could shed light on this subject? thank you in advance for your reply
Hello Bethelight,
Yes, I did it, my answer already answered by UnDisfellowshipped .
Hello peacefullpete,
There have been fine threads that dealt with the evolution of the trinitarian conceptualization of the holy spirit. Here's one by Leolaia. The Holy Spirit
Thank you peacefullpete, the evolution of the trinitarians conceptualization of Holy Spirit, Hrmmm, are you still believe with your bible? What if the bible said about HS? How about if the Bible say to you that Name of Holy Spirit = Jehovah? could you please explain to me below ?
If the Holy Spirit were merely an impersonal force, it would be BLASPHEMOUS to give it the name Jehovah. Is 2 Cor 3 blasphemous?
Now Jehovah is the Spirit; and where the spirit of Jehovah is, there is freedom. And all of us, while we with unveiled faces reflect like mirrors the glory of Jehovah, are transformed into the same image from glory to glory, exactly as done by Jehovah[the] Spirit. 2 Cor 3:17-18(NWT)
If Jehovah is the Spirit, then He must be the same Spirit that Peter was talking about in Acts 5:9 in the NWT when he spoke of the "spirit of Jehovah." "God is a Spirit," acc. to John 4:24 in the NWT. Is Jehovah God Himself an impersonal active force?
The Holy Spirit is called the "spirit of Jehovah" in these other NWT scriptures, as well:
Judges 3:10, ii Chron.18:23, 20:14, Isa 11:2, 59:19-21,61:1, 63:14, Ezek, 11:5, 37:1, Michah 2:7, 3:8, and Acts 5:9.
Jehovah refers to "His Spirit" in: Gen.6:3, Num. 11:29, Ezek.39:29, Joel 2:28-29, Hag.2:5, Zech.4:6 and 7:12.................:=)))
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Tyre
Hello again peacefullpete,
(Matthew 12: 31-32 NWT) 31 ?On this account I say to YOU , Every sort of sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the spirit will not be forgiven. 32 For example, whoever speaks a word against the Son of man, it will be forgiven him; but whoever speaks against the holy spirit, it will not be forgiven him, no, not in this system of things nor in that to come.
After reading from Matthew above. Do you dare to speak a word against to Holy Spirit? Why so unforgiven? could you explain to me what does the bible said to you?
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Tyre
i like your posts tyre. easy to read and spiritually upbuilding. being raised a witness myself, i still feel a little uncomfortable praying to jesus... but what about praying to the Holy Spirit? is that allowed by trinitarians? i have never heard anyone do it. do you have any scriptures or angles that could shed light on this subject? thank you in advance for your reply
bethelight
Hello Bethelight,I will hightlighted too about praying to Yesus.
i still feel a little uncomfortable praying to jesus
Why? Please read below.
In Acts chapter 7, Stephen was stoned to death. Before he died, Stephen looked into heaven and saw Jesus "standing at God`s right hand."(verses 55 and 56). Presumably, Jesus was standing at the
right hand of God the Father. Even tho Stephen saw God the Father,YET HE DIRECTED THE FOLLOWING PRAYER TO JESUS>
...."Lord Jesus, receive my spirit." Acts 7:59b(NWT) Why did Stephen direct this prayer to Jesus? Because he had the promise of the Lord, in which Jesus said:
Also, whatever it is that you ask in my name, I WILL DO THIS, in order that the Father may be glorified in connection with* the Son. If you ask anything in my name, I WILL DO IT. John 14:13-14(NWT)
*According to the Diaglott and the left column of the KIT, the words "connection with" shouldn`t be there. The Father is glorified IN the Son, not in "connection with" the Son.
Carefully consider the following verses:
I write these things that you may know that you have life everlasting, you who put your faith in the NAME of the SON OF GOD. And this is the confidence that we have toward HIM,that, no matter what it is that we ask according to HIS will, HE hears us. Further, if we know HE hears us respecting whatever we are asking, we know we are to have the things asked SINCE WE HAVE ASKED THEM OF HIM. 1 John 5:13-15 (NWT)
JEHOVAH WIL indeed HEAR my request for favor; JEHOVAH
HIMSELF WILL ACCEPT MY OWN PRAYER. Psalm 6:9(NWT)
Oh, I just LOVE the NWT.....................LOL..............Here is my others post, please click the link http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/10/76298/1.ashx
Prayer and Worship are closely intertwined. If Jesus is not Jehovah God, then Thomas(Jo.20:26b-29--NWT) was in DIRECT VIOLATION of the commandment to worship Jehovah God only. Jesus would have HAD to rebuke Thomas, saying:'You are NOT to worship Me, You are to worship JEHOVAH GOD ONLY'. But Jesus did NOT rebuke Thomas for his worship, only for his unbelief. Does this make the angel(Rev.), Paul and Barnabas more honorable than Jesus, or is Jesus really God, as Thomas recognized>
The WT Soc.`s position is that "My Lord and My God" is in the vocative case, spoken by Thomas when he was excited and upset.(In other words, Thomas said: "My Lord". Then, clamping his hand over his eyes, he went on to say"and[oh] my God.", much as one today might exclaim;"oMG!" This absurd proposition only worsens the situation. If this were the case, Thomas would have been guilty of blasphemy,and once again Jesus would HAVE HAD TO rebuke him. But Jesus didn`t say: "Because you have seen me you have blasphemed." and Jesus said: " Because you have seen me you have BELIEVED."
Bethelight, in a non-WTBS Soc. Bible, refer to the following scriptures in Mathew: 8:2,9:18, 14:33,15:25,20:20,28:9, and 28:17. In each of these scriptures Jesus was worshipped and ACCEPTED that Worship. The NWT uses the word "Obeisance" in place of worship in those scriptures, and the Diaglott uses "prostrated" Regardless, it was WORSHIP.(Proskuneo)................... -
peacefulpete
After reading from Matthew above. Do you dare to speak a word against to Holy Spirit?
Tell me Tyre, do your eyes bug out, head bob, and fingers uncontrolably point at the screen when you type these rantings.
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Carmel
Why does Jehovah God have to Rest? Does he have limited stamina? Only those with limited available energy have to rest! What kind of weakling God is this?
carmel of "inquiring minds want to know" class