by Shamms 16 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
I know many of you who are regulars here have probably heard this before. I need help! A dear loved one of mine has started attending the Hall. I need scriptural ammunition to combat this mind control....specifically on the "little flock" "great crowd" doctrines, the trinity, and Jesus. Your help in this combat would be greatly appreciated.
Shamms.
haven't had my coffee this morning, but my first instinct is to tell you that combat using the trinity, little flock, et al will be futile by this point. They are very proofed against doctrinal attack by the time they start attending meetings.
This is the same tactic my Great-Aunt used on my parents when they started attending 30+ years ago. They still tell the story and laugh about how "obvious an attack from Satan" it was. In fact in only the second or third study they begin to receive warnings about others attacking their faith and they are trained to believe those attacks are coming directly from Satan via their loved ones.
Instead, I would stick very specifically to policy issues. The two witness rule for child abuse. Shunning. Blood transfusion confusion. Pinatas vs. Birthdays. Info for all of these subjects can be found in these archives. I'm sure others will have things to add.
In addition, I would recommend a couple of books for you to read: Raymond Franz' "Crisis of Conscience," Steven Hassan's "Releasing the Bonds." One will give you the inside on all of these policies, and the other some strategy for communicating with your family without triggering them to shut down their logical thought.
Best of Luck,
Odrade
I've never been a JW, but I can kind of relate. I'm trying to get my JW friend to "see the light". One of the things I find interesting about JWs is most of them know very little about the early history of their religion and how doctrines have come and gone and come again throughout the years... hardly consistant with a God who is the same "yesterday, today, and tomorrow".
For example, using the "satan" ploy isn't exclusive to the JWs, although I'm sure most of them think it is. Several religions, like the JWs, break off from the Millerites of the 1840s ... those looking for the Advent of the Messiah. They too are the only "truth" and they too will play the "satan" card.
I would say to your loved one.. "there are many religions that make the same claim as the JWs... i.e. the "truth", new "light", persecution, last days, etc.; whatever the JWs say that is "exclusive" and can "prove" that they are indeed the "truth", there are other religions that use similar arguments. That being said, wisdom dictates that you keep and open mind, seek out anwers, question and be discerning. Look on the internet and find out what others have experienced in this religion. The internet is only a reference tool, and should not be condemned. Real truth will not deny examination, for real truth will prove itself, and has nothing to hide."
I'm sure others on this board can be more helpful. One website you might look at is:
http://members.aol.com/beyondjw/bj.htm
Good Luck..
Greetings Shamms,
The GREATEST of peace to you.
I can understand why you feel you need "scripture ammunition" to fight against your loved one attending the Hall, however, you must understand that our Lord said, "All whom the Father gives to ME will COME to ME. And he that comes to me, I will by no means drive away." If your loved one belongs to him and the Father has given your loved one to the Christ.. your loved one WILL come to him and your loved one WILL find him. If your loved one for now.. chooses captivity, he/she will go into captivity. However, if your loved one is a sheep, a sheep does not "harken unto the voice of strangers." Therefore at some point and some time in his/her life, your loved one will "leave" and will start thirsting and hungering for the Christ. He/she will hear what she/he wants to hear. If they really want "the truth," they will not stop until they find "the truth." The Spirit always bears witness to the truth and if they are seeking the truth, they WILL find it. The Holy Spirit compelled me to share this with you, hope you understand and take care.
Aaron
"little flock" "great crowd" doctrines, the trinity, and Jesus
Little flock and great crowd. The JWs interpet this there are only 144k born again christians. The great crowd are now considered those that suvived amageddon. Everyone that dies before will be raised.
the trinity is hard because many early bible writers were unitarian.
Jesus?
I dont get it JWs believe in jesus. He is all over the bible so a scripture with him in it is easy to find.
I know you may know all this but you need to ask specifically what you want to prove.
It will take a bit of work but try
specifically on the "little flock" "great crowd" doctrines, the trinity, and Jesus.One last thought... the first and second century Christians never taught what the JWs do about 2 different classes of Christian (those that go to heaven and those who "sleep"). Check out websites regarding the teachings of the early church fathers.... those who knew the apostles and their teachings and those who were familiar with the early scriptures....very eye-opening and damning for some JW teachings.
THe problem is the JWs are not christian. THe watchtower even says that they are not christ brothers not in the covenant etc. So they believe there are only 144,000 christians period.
THe watchtower even says that they are not christ brothers not in the covenant etc. So they believe there are only 144,000 christians period.
hmmmm, interesting comment. Do most JWs consider themselves "Christian" or not?
They claim they are christ "footstep followers", but if pressed they will admitt that the bible was writen for the faithful slave and that they fds are the real christians they are only b eneficiaries . I have heard somesay "we are not christians in that sense". THe UN registers JWs as a parachristian religion.
