A Movie For Those Who Like To Question "Reality" (page 2)

Big Tex

I'm kinda curious about this now. I hadn't heard about it before. I need to find out if it's playing here.

Thanks James

jst2laws

Hello Odrade,

"It just seems that the intentions, perceptions and intuitions are exactly the things that so-called "real scientists" seem to be dismissive of, in that they are rarely documentable and quantifiable."

Your statement is true, however, I'm going to apologetically object to the phrase you used in quotes, specifically "real" in the phrase "real scientist". Perhaps it is only a quote and not your own judgment. I have to admit just three years ago I would have agreed with the statement myself. Quite a few noted scientist have realized that the mechanistic Newtonian model does not work in explaining physics at the subatomic level. In fact Fritjof Capra feels that physics will have difficulty making any further progress in understanding what they are observing until they abandon the Newtonian mechanistic world view. An example:

"The further we penetrate into the submicroscopic world, the more we shall realize how the modern physicist, like the Eastern mystic, has come to see the world as a system of inseparable interacting and ever-moving components with the observer (the scientist) being an integral part of this system."

This is not knew. The "real scientist" Neils Borh, a founding father of quantum physics, chose the Yin/Yang symbol as his coat of arms when knighted by the Danish government for his contributions to science. True, conservative scientist holding to the traditional Newtonian world view still scoff at the "new science" and it's world view. But that does not make them the "real scientist". I enjoy your kind way of differing with JT and hope you do not take offense at what may appear to be nit-picking on my part. Jst2laws

JamesThomas

Odrade, I did not see your comments as "criticism". Perhaps my reply sounded defensive, but was not meant to be.

The most important thing, I feel, about the movie is not so much what is presented or how ( in agreement with Mark, in that it is "mind-candy), but that it may inspire some to question.

Questioning the reality of who we believe ourselves to be can shift consciousness to vistas forgotten; and into a Reality unbound by mental concept.

This is not easy, for there is a great (really big) sense of security in believing we have a grasp on what is real. The mind may even lable you insane, for beginning to question.

What is important is not what is viewed on a screen, but rather what is discovered within.

j

Odrade

Just2, I think you did misunderstand my intention anyways. I say "real scientists" because many that I've spoken to tend to discredit scientists who work with the esoteric (like the quantum scientists from the movie) insinuating that if one ventures too far into the theoretical that they are no longer true scientists. I personally don't believe that.

I was using the phrase "real scientists" in the context of certain branches of science scoffing at others--considering them to NOT be true scientists. Given how far science has come just in the last century, to be dismissive of quantum physics and other esoteric sciences is, IMO, very shortsighted.

And thanks for the complement, nice to know folks think I have something interesting to say!

O

hemp lover

JT--

Well, I've been watching for "What the Bleep" ever since you posted this. It finally opened in Dallas this weekend and my daughter and I went yesterday.

Very interesting, fascinating even at times. I especially enjoyed Ramtha's comments, as channeled by JZ Knight. The review I read afterward said that Ramtha was a 35,000 year old warrior. I haven't researched this yet and I was wondering if you'd heard of Ramtha before this movie.

Anyway - thanks for the tip. I'm glad we saw it, gave us a lot to talk/think about.

SixofNine

If my daughter starts channeling there is gonna be hell to pay!

hemp lover

Six, don't worry. I don't think FOSHLL will be channeling anytime soon. She looked at me like I was crazy when I explained it to her. Then we went to the Hare Krishna temple for a delicious vegetarian dinner.

You should go see this movie - it'll give you new material for scoffing.

Terry

About the Ramtha hoax:

http://skepdic.com/channel.html

Terry

This agrees with the great mystics of all times that basically say "there is only Consciousness".

___________________________________________________________________________

What is a "great mystic"?

Who says there is "only consciousness".

Mysticism is the acceptance of allegations without evidence or proof, either apart from or against evidence of one's sensory apparatus and one's reason. In other words, the mystic subverts your ability to know by means of learning outside things.

Mysticism is the claim to some non-sensory, non-rational, non-definable means of knowledge, such as "instinct", "intuitions", "revelation", or any form of "just knowing".

Mysticism implicitly postulates that reality is false and only the mystic's version of reality is real because it is SUPER natural.

The mystic's version of Supernatural is beyond proof and need not be questioned.

Need I point out that buying real estate on Venus is similar to buying the Mystic's definitions of the "real" reality except for the fact that Venus exists.

A burglar is trying to break into your brain and they are asking you to cut the wires on your burglar alarm!!

Tsk tsk tsk.

Markfromcali

Then again, maybe it's just a movie.

Getting excited over it either for or against may be an indication of simple reaction to the stimuli, even if there is a fair bit of processing involved. The bottom line is, did this bit of information make your mind go somewhere, have this knee jerk reaction, regardless of what you think of it? Was it just absolutely necessary to spend so much time and energy in analysis, critique and so forth?

One need not guard against information, the mind naturally receives input. You just don't need to let it drive your mind. If you're in danger of letting recorded information control your mind, (which of course has no consciousness, it's just words, images and such) what are you going to do when a real live mind shows up? Of course, this is more likely to happen if you think the mind is only information, which is evident in the spaciness of some religious people, (since they only know the info they've been programmed with) probably many of us have seen that. The fact is, though, more complexity and sophistication in a data based mind is still identification with information, it is in essence no different from the way these folks function. The mind is being dictated by a set of data in both cases, the data is different, but the essential dynamic is the same. This is what I would call mind control - or lack of it.

A Movie For Those Who Like To Question "Reality"

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