by hubert 22 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
Yes! The elders did me a favor by expelling me, the light bulbs went on, as Jesus said, you will recognize them by their fruits. Well, they didn't display any of the fruits of the spirit! My letter writing to the org. were totally ignored, no need to say anymore.
Guest 77
I admitted to a sin i never commited. Well, i didn't commit it then ......
Legally speaking, if a dub has been disfellowshippped w/o the congregation following the official written Brooklyn protocals, that congregation can be sued in a civil court of law. There have been instances where this sort of thing has happened although few in number.
Only reason I know of this is due to a discussion I had with my brother (who is an elder) a few years back. At the time he was angry at the congregation and, in his time of weakness, chose to use apostate me as his sounding board. Actually it goes quite deeper than that but it would take too long to describe the whole discussion. But in some cases, the chickens do come home to roost.
just to add. being a former m.s i sat and listened to a few discussion and activity in our hall. the brothers never directly mentioned a name but they made it real clear who they were talking about. often if there was no evidence of adultry or other sin they would remove all privilages anyway. then the hunt would begin. anyone they spoke with or hung out with was always questioned on their behavior. more or less these people were forced out of the hall then it was justified by saying they were spirtually weak and that why they left. before i left i too was under alot of critizism and had several meeting but they couldnt put anything on me...thats why i did the slow fade away..
There are two courts of law talked about here. To make sense of it all, you have to separate them. There are the bible laws and the secular laws. First, about secular law. In the US there is a definite separation of church and state. Typically, the courts will not get involved in the internal workings of a church. We could start a church of "Stand on your head and Whistle Dixie and when you fall over you are OUT." and the courts would not intervene. No laws broken there.
There is the whole matter of the civil courts, however, if you feel that someone has caused you harm. Again, the courts would likely not intervene because the principle of "buyer beware" is involved. You were informed of the rules of the club going in, so too bad for you. As has been described here, however, if the organization itself breaks its own written rules, you may have a chance to sue for damages. In that case, name the individuals who broke the rules and hold them personally responsible, as well as the organization itself because they are the ones who recruited the miscreants, and they are the ones with the deep pockets. Why didn't the organization keep the elders in check?
As for the bible laws, who do you appeal to if they are broken? Jehovah, of course. In my opinion, this is one of the fundamental flaws of this organization. There are no human-led checks and balances that we see in secular government, and in many churches. In many churches, and incompetent pastor can be voted out, his contract expires. In secular government, the President gets four years to prove himself. The Watchtower Society shows remarkable inflexibility. I believe this is because once in a position of power, it is well-nigh impossible to budge a Governing Body member until death. Old geezers are not very sympathetic of the problems of youth. And how JW youth suffer!
Yes, they keep 'records'.
They certainly do. However, lest you think these are all catalogued and archived in some easily accessible fashion, I'm sure former secretaries can tell all kinds of stories that show the JW's record-keeping is as sloppy as their theology.
Two examples:
1. A guy who had been df'd (for adultery) in a complex case that required several JC hearings was eventually reinstated. About three years later, he left his new wife and took up with yet another woman, which led to a new round of meetings being scheduled. When the elders assigned to the committee looked through the locked filing cabinet for the sealed envelope that would contain all the previous committee's notes and a copy of the form sent to the society, they were surprised to find nothing. No envelope. No file. And nothing was ever sent to the WTS! The former secretary, who was also the chairman of the original committee, had moved to another congo. When contacted, he was adamant that the forms were filled out and the envelope placed in the filing cabinet. But the new secretary claimed never to have seen it. No problem! Two of the original committee were still in the congregation, they briefed a third elder assigned to the JC, and they DF'd him in about five minutes at a meeting the accused didn't bother to attend. This time, the forms got sent, though.
2. A newly appointed secretary went through the file cabinet and arbitrarily tossed (he said he shredded them) all the sealed judicial envelopes that were more than 3 years old. He said he thought the body had received a letter to that effect and that it was read at a previous elder's meeting, although no one else recalled it. I always thought he read it on this forum, as this is the recently revised policy, I believe, in the U.K., and has been discussed here previously.
Click my bio/profile over yonder to the left,say's all.
[edited:I was illegally held hostage [cult cocooned my the 'no brainer container'] in the first place.
Thanks for all your replies, friends.
Especially:
Gumby... for the "official" rules.
Merrymagdalen... for the Bible quotes.
And all the others who replied with your comments.
I was also wondering how shunning also affected your lives, because of being Df'd.
I am trying to see if there is a relationship between the shunning and disfellowshipping, if it goes hand and hand.
Thanks......Hubert
If it is true, willyloman, that elders read this site to keep up on "current light", perhaps we should make up some new rules.
I don't know that I was 'illegally disfellowshiped" but the reason for being df'ed was pretty weak. I became inactive and went a little crazy doing drugs and drinking. My cousin, also inactive, partied with me for long time. He and another inactive girl hooked up, partied with us and decided to go back to the cong. I don't know if they disclosed that they had been sleeping together, but they definitely ratted me out. The elders came and hunted me down. I met with them (I was clean at this point) confessed my sins and admitted my remorse. I also told them that I did not see myself returning to meetings anytime in the near future because of my anger with the congregation, etc. They sent me out to my car (as the meeting was starting, so all these jw's, including family members, saw me leaving crying), deliberated for five minute and called me back in. They told me that they were disfellowshipping me, not for the drugs and alcohol (they felt I was repentant), but because I would not commit to coming back to meetings!!!! I was outraged and stormed out of there, even though they begged me to stay and discss things. I have not and will not set foot in a kindgom hall ever again!!!
