by Simon 60 Replies latest social current
Mac,
Christ, I'm tired...been a long night...I'm not ignorant of Greek history...was not intentionally inferring that we were the originators of democratic process...just pointing out that we left when you sucked and sucked mightily!.
How about French History? Sleepy may have meant that rather than Greece (when talking about "getting rid of Kings and Queens "). Although I can only speak for myself...
Got to be honest and say it really buggs me that Britain is not putting right some of the mistaken beliefs people have of the second world war. Why are we not making films that portray the true story
Because we have no real national film industry to speak of and thats why crappy Hollywood insists the U.S won ww2 on its own!United states navy finds the enigma machine anyone?Utter baloney ,but typical.
(sorry,bit off topic,pissed off with the Jingoistic crap)
fleaman,
so, talking about the enigma machine, :))), what's your version of the story? I'm very very curious..... Just one or two sentences answering the following questions:
1) how it was found
2)who decoded it
Edited to add: just to avoid hijacking the thread, here are the answers: http://www.codesandciphers.org.uk/virtualbp/poles/poles.htm
1) how it was found
2)who decoded it
This is one of those "depends who you ask" questions.
The poles claimed to have deciphered the enigma machine as did the british (Mathematician Alan Turing / Bletchley park) and it was the latter centre that was regularly used to decode intercepted messages.
The only thing for certain is that the ones who captured it in the film ... didn't.
Pole.
The British war effort was helped substantially by the Polish people not just with the work at Bletchley Park but also some of the Best Pilots in the battle of Britain.They certainly had the incentive ...the atrocities committed in Poland by the Nazis was on a par,if not worse,than the terror in the Soviet Union.
The poles claimed to have deciphered the enigma machine as did the british (Mathematician Alan Turing / Bletchley park) and it was the latter centre that was regularly used to decode intercepted messages.
I don't think anywhere in the links you've provided a claim is made that the British were first to break the code. The centre you mentioned used a "technology" which had been first researched by the Poles ten years before.
Honestly I don't think what you said does justice to the history of deciphering the Enigma machine. ("It depends on who you ask, so we don't know.."), but I realize no single statement can do justice to the problem.
If it matters anything, historically it was the Poles who started work on deciphering Enigma, developed the first efficient methodology and achieved considerable success. They shared those secrets with the British, who continued their work for two reasons.
First: Poland considered France and Britain allies (not sure if it was a mutual feeling ).
Second:
The Poles, realizing time was running out before the Germans invaded, and unable to extend their techniques with available resources, decided in mid-1939 to share their work, and passed to the French and the British some of their ersatz 'Enigmas', information on Rejewski's breakthrough, and on the other techniques they had developed. The information was shipped to France in diplomatic baggage; the British share went on to Bletchley Park.
I think all of resources you've given are very fair about the subject. I just felt your conclusion wasn't representative of what you can find there. So if anyone's interested, let them read it and draw their wn conclusions.
fleaman,
thanks for acknowledging these facts.
For your freedom and ours!!!
That's our slogan. It's a pity we Poles, aren't that heroic in the time of peace, so we'd only have to fight for other countries' freedom :).
I don't think anywhere in the links you've provided a claim is made that the British were first to break the code. The centre you mentioned used a "technology" which had been first researched by the Poles ten years before.
The Poles intercepted and 'broke' an early version of the Enigma machine. Some of this know-how was given to the British and helped them to break the later & more complex enigma machines. The capture of U110 helped to break them too.
The bottom line is, no Americans were involved in it unlike it is portrayed by Hollywood (it's amazing they didn't cast the British as the evil baddies like the usually do )
"we left when you sucked and sucked mightily!."
Remember theres no "we" and no "you" when you talk about history.
People left Europe to make new lives in a New land for many reasons.If Britain sucked so much how exactly did it become so rich and powerful , along with France , Germany Spain and Italy?
