Pitcairn Islanders - Paedophiles?

by Englishman 12 Replies latest watchtower child-abuse

• 

  Englishman

  The descendents of the crew of Captain Blighs ship, HMS Bounty, still live on the tiny UK dependancy of Pitcairn Island in the Pacific. They number a mere 47, the islands total population.

  Many have been accused of molesting under-age children, and the UK government has set up court on the island to resolve the matter. Story here: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asia-pacific/3702448.stm

  Anthropologist Desmond Morris asserts, in todays Times, that the islanders have simply reverted to a primitive tribal community.

  He claims that having sex with a post-pubertal girl is exactly what nature intended and that the girls age is irrelevant and that many tribal people throughout the world endorse that pattern.

  He says that only when the boundaries are pushed back to having sex with pre-pubertal girls can such an act be classed as paedophilia.

  I must confess to being astonished at all this. I've met many post-pubertal girls who are still very much in their childhood regardless of the fact that nature has seen fit to make them capable of child-bearing at an early age.

  Englishman.
• 

  jwbot

  He claims that having sex with a post-pubertal girl is exactly what nature intended and that the girls age is irrelevant and that many tribal people throughout the world endorse that pattern.

  There is a contradiction in his statement! If they are pre-pubertal then it is NOT nature...yet. Its PRE! PRE!
• 

  Farkel

  E-Man,
  
  I thought that the majority of the Bounty descendants moved from Pitcairn to Norfolk Island years ago.
  
  Norfolk Island Settlements>

  Farkel
• 

  Leolaia

  Thanks for bringing this to my attention too, Englishman.
  

  I have actually been quite interested in the Pitcairnese for some time. Their language, Pitkern, is the perfect example of 'desert-island'-type evolution in language, where the Founder's Effect can best be observed. Too bad the society seems to be kinda screwed up, apparently.

  There are also descendents of Fletcher Christian's group on the island of Norfolk, which is also an isolated piece of rock in the south Pacific. It would be interesting to compare the two and see if there is a similar situation.

  I think what Morris might be talking about is that taboos are socially enforced through cultural institutions like laws, the courts, etc., and because of the island's near complete social isolation, they have historically had little access to external institutions to regulate acceptable behavior. But he seems, by saying that this is "what nature intended," that he is naturalizing their behavior. Maybe it might be a commentary on the inherent ugliness of human nature when it is unchecked by social institutions. But one has to also wonder whether the isolation itself has psychologically created an "unnatural" situation among the islanders, especially if the culture itself is obsolescent. I mean, only 47 islanders? That's not a sustainable number. In real tribal societies, tribes could be as small as 47 but they depend on exogamous marriage to be sustainable. But there are no other nearby "tribes" that the Pitcairnese are in sexual contact with. So is what naturally occurs in tribal societies, or is this an effect of a dying population where social institutions all break down. Tribes have taboos too.

  Edit: Yeah, I misread that sentence too.
• 

  Satanus

  From this thread, it's not clear if the girls were pre or post pubertal.

  S
• 

  jwbot

  woops I stand corrected...it clearly states post.

  Well perhaps its Older men having sex with young girls is not natural vs. young men having sex with young ladies close to their age. Old men...thats not natural.

  But again, is it natural for humans to not have social norms and moores? I think not. As humans we always move towards a governed society.
• 

  Satanus

  It looks like they reverted back to old testement bible standards. Those jews that god chose took girls as soon as they hit puberty. W anthropologii (bad word, i know)getting involved, this could be an interesting study in socialogy and tribalism.

  S
• 

  Leolaia

  Satanus....As I stated above, I think a "tribal" explanation ignores the fact that the population is not sustainable, it's probably dying, and it's in isolation, and all sorts of aberrant things can happen in such a situation. For instance, because of the population disparity, there may not be enough women in the population of post-pubertal age and so men are resorting to younger and younger girls. I would like to see the specifics on what the population dynamics are.
• 

  D8TA

  Soooo....should they be prosecuted criminaly? Explain why.

  Regardless of anybody´s ¨opinion¨ outside THIS forum, want personal opionions ( can´t go wrong with those ) here, as in...because Dr. So-n-So said this, or Judge Judy said that...nope, want good old fashion personal opinions. I am not going to debate this. I am just interested...serious. My only questions without response.

  My opinion? No. Why? Because it is still a tribal system. What´s next? Tribes in Indonesia and Africa succumbing to the law of the new world? Tricky business.
• 

  Satanus

  Apparently, a girl as young as 5 was assaulted by one of the guys. http://www.nzherald.co.nz/storydisplay.cfm?storyID=3596861&thesection=news&thesubsection=world

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  Former residents of Pitcairn yesterday painted a picture of a community in which young girls were used as sexual playthings and rape and violence were a way of life.

  One man, Dave Brown, allegedly assaulted a series of girls aged as young as 5 over a period of 21 years. One was indecently assaulted in the Seventh Day Adventist church as her friend looked on, the Pitcairn Supreme Court heard.

  Deputy prosecutor Christine Gordon told Justice Jane Lovell-Smith that Brown's attitude was "young girls were available for him as and when he chose".

  Brown, 49, is charged with 13 indecent assaults and two acts of gross indecency with a child between 1970 and 1991. He is one of seven islanders before the court on a total of 55 child sex charges.

  Six more men now living in Australia and New Zealand will go on trial next year, charged with 41 similar offences.

  Steve Christian, Pitcairn's mayor, is in the first batch, and one of his alleged victims told the court yesterday that he tried to drag her out of her tent and have sex with her during a trip to Oeno, an uninhabited island in the Pitcairn group.

  The woman, who grew up in the British dependent territory settled by the Bounty mutineers, also claimed that Christian came to her house and tried to get into bed with her while his wife, Olive, was giving birth.

  Asked by Christian's lawyer, Paul Dacre, why she did not inform anyone in authority, the woman - now 51 and living overseas - said it would have been pointless.

  "That's the way it is on Pitcairn. You get abused, you get raped. It's a normal way of life on Pitcairn."

  The trial continues.

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  S