by ladonna 20 Replies latest jw friends
We were taught in the WTBTS as the bible clearly states that God created the heavens and the earth and on the seventh day he rested.
Has it occurred to anyone else that God got up to a lot of wars ect whilst he was supposedly sleeping?????
Not only the wars but the actual writing of the bible which was pounded into us as being inspired by God.
If only I could do as much in my sleep.
Ana....
Ana, God even performed all the miracles in rescuing the Israelites time and again. Oh yes, plus the flood, sending Jesus to be killed and then resurrecting him. Lots more, too.
Wow, if we could do half that much in our sleep we would have all day to enjoy ourselves.
Dearest Ladonna... may you have peace!
Like most, dear one, you misunderstand the meaning of the word 'rest', most probably because it has been misinterpreted to you. Did you not read and did you hear that my Lord said, "My Father keeps on working and I keep on working..." and "since a promise is left of entering INTO His rest..." and "it remains for some to enter into it..."
If my Father, then, is still 'working'... if my Lord did such 'work' and then 'finished the work that was given [him]'... and indeed, if WE are to 'work the works of Him that sent [my Lord]' and 'work NOT for the food that perishes but for the food that remains for life everlasting...'
then the 'rest' that you perceive to meant is in error. You have been misled.
If you will notice, at Genesis 2:2, it states:
"And He proceeded to rest on the seventh day from all his work that He had made."
And yet, He 'planted a garden'... and put the man IN the garden. Indeed, Adam... and Eve... 'entered into His rest'... and it remains for some of US... to 'enter into it' as well.
God rested in that He ceased from the creation and works of what was PHYSICAL... but He has NEVER stopped moving ahead with that which is SPIRITUAL. As my Lord said, "My Father KEEPS on working, and I keep on working", and as my Father said to my Lord, "GO... SUBDUING... in the midst of your enemies."
Both my Father and my Lord 'keep working', just as I and my true brothers have kept working... to BUILD THE TEMPLE OF GOD, the true place of 'rest'... for the spirit of God and all those who possess such spirit. It is in that 'temple' that 'acceptable sacrifices' are made to God, and from which a 'restful odor'... the prayers of the holy ones... rises.
WE are the 'temple' of God, a 'house' harmoniously joined together, being 'built up' into a place for God to 'inhabit by spirit'. IT is the 'place of rest'... which exists in the kingdom of my Lord, and which all who 'wish', by means of holy spirit... may 'enter'.
I bid you peace,
A slave of Christ,
SJ
Hi A Guest,
Thankyou for that interpretation. It 'is'a fresh aspect of what I was taught in the JW's.
Thankyou,
Ana
AGuest,
How can someone be misinformed of the meaning of the word "rest". It is not a long word. It is not a complicated word.
Now you interprete it to mean no more physchal work, only spiritual work. It seems to me that parting the red sea, making the earth stand still for Joshua, and destroying two cities with fire and brimestone is a whale of a lot of physical work.
To re-emphasize what I think SJ was talking about, and to give you the perspective of the Rabbinical tradition (hey, it's thier book, I trust their interp thereof); God rested from CREATING. The Rabbis recognize that God sustains the whole of creation by and active and conscouse force of His will ( ok, I misspelled a word or two SUE ME). God's PROVIDENCE (which we are speaking of now) ALWAYS remains active, if it didn't all things would cease to exist. So, while God rested from the work of CREATING, God still "works" and maintains all things, oversees all things, and sustains all things. Part of this goes into the reason the Rabbis explained that the Priests could sacrafice even on the sabbath.
Hope that gives you a better perspective on the term rest.
As an interesting side note, the Hebrew Shabbat is somewhere between Rest and Seven as far as it's meaning.
Shalom
Yeru
YERUSALYIM
"Vanity! It's my favorite sin!"
[Al Pacino as Satan, in "DEVIL'S ADVOCATE"]
Dearest larc... may you have peace!
And, Yerusalyim, thank you and peace to you, too... and you are correct. May I expound on this a bit more? Thank you.
larc, one CAN actually misinterpret the word 'rest', although a tiny word and uncomplicated word, IF one is translating into ENGLISH and therefore interpreting in ENGLISH... a GREEK or HEBREW word. I am sure you know that what a word means in English is not necessarily what it means in another language. And that is a primariy 'problem' with earthling man's attempt at translating the Bible: most of them spoke German or English (which is closely related to German), and therefore ASSUMED that certain words mean/meant certain things. But for a fact, they did/do not.
An example? The word 'minister'. In English, that word has at least two meanings: to render service to... OR to preach to... and it is predominantly used when describing the latter. However, in Hebrew and Greek, as rendered in the scriptures and other Bible writings, it has only one meaning... to render servitude to another. To minister TO someone, not BE the minister (i.e., pastor, reverend, etc.) of someone. A 'minister'... is a SERVANT... and in contrast to the religious misrendering does NOT set such one above apart from others... but actually renders such one LOWER than all others. Such one, then, considers ALL others superior to HIM.
John 13:12-17
The word 'rest', as connotated with reference to my Father at Genesis 2:2, means a cessation from 'works'. But the 'works' that my Father 'rested' from at that time, were those which resulted in the physical realm. There IS no 'rest', per se, in the spirit realm, at least, not in the since of a 'cessation' of my Father's 'works'. The only time anything remotely close to that occurred was when, as John reported, 'there was silence in heaven a half hour.' Let me tell you, that was a MAJOR event, for things are occurring constantly in the spirit realm, including 'noise'. For there to be silence, there had to be a cessation of all activity. THAT has occurred only once that I am aware of.
However, the 'rest' that my Father spoke of in regards to US... and 'entering' into HIS starts... when we desist from OUR 'works'... from doing our OWN 'will'... and do His. And in that way, then, we can 'enter into HIS rest'... into HIS 'will'... and into HIS 'works'.
Isaiah 58:3-59:4
Hebrews 3:7-4:16
And since there is no labor or toiling in the spirit realm (which is why my Lord said, "Come to ME all you who are toiling... and I will REFRESH you), the part of the spirit realm that is the kingdom of my Father and of my Lord... is a 'rest'.
Adam and Eve, by residing in the Garden of Eden, had entered into that 'rest', for indeed the land 'gave it produce'. They did not have to work 'in the sweat of their brow' in order to eat and exist. But, because they did their OWN 'will'... or 'works'... rather than my Father's... they, then, we cast OUT of that 'rest'.
The Israelites, too, after having been set free from slavery to Egypt, were being led to a place of rest, the promised land, wherein they would be given a land 'flowing with milk and honey', that would yield its produce without labor from them. But, because they continually did their OWN 'works'... their OWN 'will'... and repeatedly rebelled against the will of my Father by not listening to His voice (as spoken through Christ, through holy spirit, through Moses), all those over age 20 did NOT 'enter into that rest'. And indeed, that was only the TEMPORARY 'rest'... the antitype of the TRUE rest... the true 'promised land' of New Jerusalem.
In that City, New Jerusalem, however, there are no 'works'... or 'will'... but that of my Father. And since there is no labor or toil... there is a true 'rest'. Since man lives there NOT by bread, but by the Word of God, since man will live and exist by means of the 'leaves of the Tree of Life'... the bread of life, the flesh of my Lord... and the 'living water' that issues from his throne... his 'blood'... HOLY SPIRIT... man will not have to work in the sweat of his brow in order to survive and exist. All one will need to do then... as all one needs to do NOW... is eat... from the Tree of Life, my Lord, the TRUE VINE... the 'root' of Jesse... 'SPROUT!'... and drink from his 'cistern' the 'water' that flows FROM him... 'living water'... holy spirit.
Revelation 22:1-3a (please note, that while indeed there are many 'branches'... there is only ONE Tree. The WTBTS has intentionally misrendered this verse to accommodate their false teaching of the 144,000 and their 'place' in heaven...)
John 15:1-7
John 4:10, 13, 14
And that is the true 'rest' of God, which exists inside the walls of His Holy City... into which flesh... with its blood... cannot enter. We, can, however, 'taste' of that water... now.
John 6:48-56
John 7:37, 38
'Entering' into that true rest, along with residing in the spirit body, I promise you, is what is meant by TRUE 'freedom'. When we desist from our own 'works' and do the 'will' of God... which is MANIFESTED in loving Him... and ALL... including our 'enemies', rather than doing what 'delights' us 'and saying a word'... which, in most cases results NOT in love... but in selfishness... we become truly free.
Indeed, one of the things I am MOST grateful for for having been 'set free' from the WTBTS... and religion in general... is that now I have the FREEDOM... to love EVERYONE... including my 'enemies'. People that I would not have been able to love and show love for previously, because of various 'differences', including race, sex, sexual orientation, nationality, religion, creed... whathaveyou... I can now love 'as I love myself'.
That, dear ones, is true freedom... to love (not lust for, but genuinely have philea AND agape love for)... ALL of mankind. No matter WHAT your 'difference'... including 'sin'. Truly, what a 'load' off... what a lifting up of burden... what a wonderful... 'rest'.
I bid you all peace!
A slave of Christ and TRUE servant to the Household of God, Israel,
SJ
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Yakki Da
Kent
"The only difference between God and Adolf Hitler is that God is more proficient at genocide."
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Hi SJ,
I keep reading and listening to religious people who claim they have God's view of things, YK, you, the pastor of my wife's church and others on TV. I have a problem though, with all the differences of opinion that you all have, how can anyone of you prove that you truly have God's real message for us humans, other than your personal claims that originate in you own little minds. How could someone be absolutely sure that he had found the "truth"?
Religion is just a state of mind that serves the purpose of bringing a peace within someones life. As far as it being a reality there is no way to prove it. All the prayer that I have seen uttered is just a hope that maybe it might help, but ninety five percent of the time it has no effect at all. I read the other day in the scriptures that all prayers that are uttered in accord with God's will are answered. Well, if it is God's will it will be done anyway, so why bother with praying?
You seem to think that Jesus answers your questions verbally or mentally, but I really can't understand why he answers you and not all the others who claim the same relationship as you.
Just some questions that I wonder if you can answer with proof other than just words.
Ken P.
Dearest Ken P., may you have peace!
I understand your 'dilemna', and by the spirit of my Father that is in me, holy spirit, by means of my Lord, I have been granted leave to answer your question:
First, God DOES speak to you, just as He speaks to all. It is YOU who 'contends' with Him that He does not. The 'error' is yours, however, in that it is YOU... that does not LISTEN. And why is it that you do not listen?
Because:
You may have been told... and/or perhaps you simply believe... that He does not speak. That... is a lie.
You may have been told... and/or perhaps you simply believe... that if He did speak, it would not be to you. That, too... is a lie.
You may have been told... and/or perhaps you simply believe... that if He DOES speak, He only speaks through 'special' ones and it is to them that you must listen. That, too, is a lie.
You may have been told... and/or you may simply believe... that if He did speak, you would hear it with your physical ears. That is an error, for God is a SPIRIT, and it is with the spirit that you must 'worship' Him. And people worship what they can see... and hear. In order to see and hear Him, then, you must see and hear Him... in the SPIRIT.
Hebrews 12:25
Job 33:13-17
John 10:1-8, 27
Matthew 17:3
Matthew 23:10
John 4:24
And, in truth, it may be because you only wish to see and hear Him... PHYSICALLY. However, if so, it is only so that you may have your SENSUAL cravings fed... your need to have your SENSE of physical SIGHT, SOUND, TOUCH, TASTE and SMELL... 'pleasured'... and NOT because you want to hear what He has to say... to YOU.
James 4:3
You do not listen... because you THINK you do not hear... because you lack FAITH. And you show you lack such faith, because when you DO hear, you dismiss it.
James 1:5-8
You DISMISS it, because you do not want to have your 'works'... reproved.
John 3:19-21
Do you truly want to HEAR, Ken P.? Then you must be willing to LISTEN. And it is to the One that my Father has DESIGNATED to speak to you that you must listen. For when he speaks to you... he will reveal to YOU... YOUR nakedness and uncleaness... FIRST... so that you can have such nakedness and uncleanliness 'clothed'... and 'cleansed'. This, in order that you can 'carry the utensils of JAH'.
Many of those 'chosen' by my Father to carry His 'utensils', the 'vessels' of His Household... acknowledged their uncleaness, their nakedness, their weakness... at some point... whether outright verbally... or in their heart. Moses said he was 'slow of tongue' and had acknowledged in his heart that he was a murderer. Jeremiah said, "Hey, I'm just a kid". Isaiah was WILLING to go and speak, even though he risked being thought crazy. My Lord, although not a sinner, considered himself as one.
Most people want to use the 'light' of my Lord to look into a window and see what my Father has to say... about others; it does not work that way. One must FIRST... use that 'light'... to look into a MIRROR. One must first see one's RAFTERS... before one can see how to extract 'straws'. But most don't want that. It's too 'revealing', too 'painful'... too unpleasant. They would rather point fingers.
If you truly want to hear the voice of my Lord, Ken P., then YOU... must ask, not doubting... and LISTEN when he responds. To what he first says to YOU... about you. And not close your HEART to the truth of what he reveals to you. And as you draw closer to His Light (John 8:12), and see where to 'clothe' yourself and in what to be cleansed, your progressive cleanliness will the REFLECT that light... and THEN you will be able to see others. And when you do, you must see them with the same love and compassion with which he saw you... and speak to them what he tells you... with the same love and compassion he spoke it to you.
But you can't see others in the dark... if YOU are in the dark. And you will remain in the dark... unless you come into the Light.
John 3:19-21
As for me, I am nothing but a servant in the House of that One. And as such servant, I follow his voice. That voice, from time to time tells ME... with regard to BOTH the wicked and righteous...
"When I tell you to warn someone from ME...
and you do not warn them so as to save their
soul from death... their blood... I shall ask back...
from YOUR hand."
How then, can I say I have love for my Father and my Lord, if I do not obey their voice... and how can I saw I have love for my brother AND my enemy, if, when that voice directs me to warn them... I 'beg off' and care not? In what way have I loved my fellowman... 'as myself'? In what way can I say I have 'affection' for my Lord and will willingly 'care for' his sheep, if I do not expose to them, what has been exposed to me? If indeed, I know a 'wolf' is afoot, should I remain silent? Indeed, I would want to be warned... and was myself warned... in love. I therefore pass that love on.
I do not judge, Ken P., for I have no authority to judge. I can only speak what I am given, give the glory to the One that 'sent' me or directed me TO speak... and let the matter lie between him and the one 'hearing'... or 'refraining'. And if he tells me to warn, I warn; if he tells me to forgive, I forgive. And if he tells me to release... I release. So that in the end, it will not be said that I didn't care... and didn't do... 'just so'.
And Ken? I am not 'religious'. 'Religion'... IS... 'a snare and a racket'. I have asked NOTHING from you, but offer myself TO you... as your servant. For I am a good-for-nothing slave, a servant of the Household of God, Israel... and what I've done... is what I OUGHT to have done.
I bid you peace!
YOUR servant, and a slave of Christ,
SJ
