Is it Legal or not?

by wizedup 7 Replies latest jw friends

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  wizedup

  I noticed in Phil: 1:7 all my translations say, "It is right for me to feel this way about all of you, since I have you in my heart; for whether I am in chains or defending and confirming the gospel, all of you share in God's grace with me.

  The NWT inserted ".... defending and legally establishing of the good news."

  They footnote it to Acts 25:11 where Paul says he's willing to die if he's deserving out of wrong doing....then " If, on the other hand, none of those things exist of which these men accuse me, no man can hand me over to them as a favor. I appeal to Caesar!"

  Now why do you think they needed to insert "legally" when it exists in no other translation that I can find? Could it be to scripturally back up the need for all their lawyers? Interesting insertion, isn't it?
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  AK - Jeff

  The more I read the NWT, and examine it, the more I wonder how I ever accepted it at all. It is in my opinion a doctrinal revisionist version. When a translation is 'translated' by one man alone in essence, how could his doctine and viewpoint not get there. the insertion of Jehovah in the NT is the best example of that - they even admit that it does not appear in the oldest manuscripts, yet reason it in - I read many translations now - and find that the message is less cloudy too.

  Jeff
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  jst2laws

  It is not my habit, since leaving the WT, to get into word studies but I will pass this much on. The word the Society uses here to translate as " defending and legally establishing of the good news " is

  NT:627
  apologia (ap-ol-og-ee'-ah); from the same as NT:626; a plea ("apology"): KJV - answer (forself), clearing ofself, defence. (Biblesoft's New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. Copyright (c) 1994, Biblesoft and International Bible Translators, Inc.)

  It does not imply anything "legal". The use of the Greek word is in the New Testament is only 10 times and is translated as "answer" for one self or "make a defense" for ones self. However this is what Barnes Commentary says, which according to Ray Franz the WT writers lean on:

  Phil: 1:7
  NT:627
  apologia (ap-ol-og-ee'-ah); from the same as NT:626; a plea ("apology"): KJV - answer (forself), clearing ofself, defence. (Biblesoft's New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. Copyright (c) 1994, Biblesoft and International Bible Translators, Inc.) Phil 1:7
  Greek: apology. He is probably referring to the time when he made his defense before Nero, and vindicated himself from the charges which had been brought against him;
  (from Barnes' Notes, Electronic Database. Copyright (c) 1997 by Biblesoft)

  I suspect this was all Freddie Franz needed to validate the JW use of courts by translating the text as " defending and legally establishing of the good news ". It's a stretch, but better than some of their dogma that is literally 'pulled from the air'. Certainly they have made use of translating the text as an opportunity to establish doctrine. Jst2laws
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  OldSoul

  G951 - βεβαίωσις - bebaiōsis beb-ah'-yo-sis

  From G950; stabiliment: - confirmation.

  G950

  - βεβαιόω - bebaioō - beb-ah-yo'-o

  From G949; to stabilitate (figuratively): - confirm, (e-) stablish.

  The term from which "legally established" was drawn is "bebaiōsis" (the Strong's Greek Lexicon numbers are provided for reference). The King James Version rendered it "confirmation" but the denotation at the time in which Paul penned the words was to "legally confirm" or "establish basis in law." Being a lawyer, after writing "defend" (the word Steve explained very well) this word adds weight to the just described activity of legal defense of by including legal argument in favor of, or "confirmation of."
  

  Both of which he did to great effect as recorded in Acts. The two terms Paul uses here discusses the entire legal spectrum in one phrase "apologia kai bebaiōsis". Such inclusiveness of application is typical of Paul's writings.

  The word "kai" is always a copulative and sometimes a cumulative speech particle. The terms on one side of "kai" would never be confused for the terms on the other side. No one would make that mistake.

  Respectfully,
  B_Ing Invisible
• 

  mustang

  defending and legally establishing of the good news".

  And... this became the title a of a booklet the WTS wrote on legal strategies for setting up congregations and preaching, dated ~ 1950, if I remember correctly.

  Mustang
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  jst2laws

  Hello again OldSoul,

  Very interesting. I commented on the word the word apologia (627) translated an "defending" and you brought another point on on the word bebaiōsis translated "confirming" with additional clarification:

  The King James Version rendered it "confirmation" but the denotation at the time in which Paul penned the words was to "legally confirm" or "establish basis in law." Being a lawyer, after writing "defend" (the word Steve explained very well) this word adds weight to the just described activity of legal defense of by including legal argument in favor of, or "confirmation of."

  I looked in a few Bible commentaries but could not find this thought: "at the time in which Paul penned the words was to "legally confirm" or "establish basis in law." . I only checked Barnes, Adam Clark's commentary and Jamieson, Fausset, and Brown commentary. Can you tell me from where this quote "activity of legal defense of by including legal argument" comes? This would surely be what Freddie was relying on for translating the verse as he did. I AM concerned that I can not find it in the commonly accepted Bible commentaries. But as I said,

  It is not my habit, since leaving the WT, to get into word studies

  So maybe I am getting sloppy.

  Steve
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  OldSoul

  Yes, I can provide a reference. It had nothing to do with Bible commentary, so that might explain why you couldn't find it. It was a work relating to the Greek words used in ancient Greek literature (a casual interest of mine) that made a reference to Strong's insufficient treatment of the word "bebaiōsis" and its distinction from "bebaioō." That caught my attention since I wasn't expecting any discussion at all of Strong's lexicon. I paraphrased it, I didn't quote it directly.

  It will take some time to find it again though. But the word "bebaiōsis" is present in legal documents from the time, used in this sense. You might be able to find those references more quickly, because that was how I verified the cursory reference.

  The operative particle "kai" translated "and" is the division point between the two translated terms. It isn't possible for a student of Greek to miss a particle that conveys a clear transition between "apologia" and "bebaiōsis," so "defending and legally" wasn't what was translated from "apologia," only "defending" would have been. The interposed word "kai" joins two distinct concepts, so "legally establishing" is what the other side, or "bebaiōsis," was translated into.

  You will probably understand more after you check your mail... (sorry, more code)

  Respectfully,
  B_Ing Invisible
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  OldSoul

  Maybe I just don't understand the significance of the verse in the context you gentle men are discussing it... the application to doctrine can diverge broadly from the meaning translated. Case in point, Proverbs 4:18