by truthseeker 30 Replies latest jw friends
I notice that in the January 1st Watchtower they state in a box on page 14 that from now on the Worldwide report will be published in the February 1st Watchtower.
I wonder why the change ?
Someone did say they were told there was a manpower shortage at Bethel. But surely in this day and age with the computers we have, compiling the reports from round the world should be easier than it was years ago.
EVERYBODY LISTEN!!!
IMO none of this matters- the "numbers" are unreliable. I personally collected the time, meeting attendance figures and memorial attendance figures for YEARS 1985-2001 and in three different congregations in two states. I was almost removed from my "holy spirit" appointed position because when the PO gave the figures to the CO and I heard the CO say our "numbers" looked good- I gasped!!! I raised my hand and said with all respect how could 65% attendance be good? He looked puzzled and asked what I was talking about. It was then that the PO turned and gave me a look of "just wait till the CO is gone,buddy" and boy did I pay. One of the MS who happened to be my father in law also GROSSLY exaggerated his "time" every time. I know I was out every day and collected the time. Nothing was ever done about any of this except to shut me up and stop making a fuss over trivial matters. I don't care what people want to declare for any "numbers" personally, but I do care that misleading reports of growth and positiveness are given when it's not true. Can we say Enron? Just more straining out the gnat and gulping down the camel...
And that's the FACT JACK!
U/D
When I was a young adult in the 1960's and 1970's we had clear cut teachings, a purpose, and a pay off in the not too distant future. We were all only going to be on the dirty street corners pedaling our papers for a short time. Now the Witnesses who really don't like being Witnesses don't even have the hope of a quick ending to it. They can see they are in plod along mode and no new dates to look forward to.
Now there isn't even a clear teaching. The appointment doctrine is mashed yams. 1914 is a lost cause. It has no purpose without the generation doctrine. Nobody can figure out the blood guidelines any more. I have seen two generations of teachings become worthless and discarded by the Watch Tower Corporation just in my lifetime. The TRUTH that leads to eternal life turned out to be the lie that leads to eternal witnessing.
The TRUTH that leads to eternal life turned out to be the lie that leads to eternal witnessing.
Hey Garybus - may I use that quote -I love it?
Hey Garybus - may I use that quote -I love it?
:-)
Hi Steve2,
Your comment " I think it is equally plausible that growing numbers of inactive witnesses simply "hang around" the organisation in one form or another, unable to leave it, but also unable to re-commit to the door-knocking activity" is quite accurate.
I also think it is more of a drag on the organization having these "hanger ons" around than if they left completely. The R&F is more likely to be negatively affected by their lack of interest and this might carry more weight than direct attacks from outside. The rot usually occurs internally because an outside attack brings any group together, even if for a very short period of time.
Thanks Truthseeker for you fine works. I just love to watch these numbers and the direction they are headed.
For a numbers organization it must be everso humbling. :)
battman
Hey truthseeker,
Nice work. However, I had one question. You write:
Japan this year lost close to 6,000 publishers, even after baptisms were taken into account.
However, when I look at the chart, it appears that the 2003/2004 averages for Japan are, respectively, 217,020 and 217,097. That looks like a gain of 77. Meager, yes. But what was your -6000 figure based on?
SNG
Blondie,
Congregations started getting too competitve and finally in the 70's the monthly quota of 10 hours monthly per publisher was dropped officially and the charts disappeared. I found an old one stored away in a closet in one KH when I was doing spring cleaning.
Maybe this will go the same way.
Imagine the kind of disappointment it would create. If we get excited by the Annual report, then how much more so do active witnesses? When the annual reports disappear the JWs will have nothing to live for. No partaker ticker figures to speculate about, no reports of "China opening". If the WTS is becoming more and more corporate then yearly reports are the only reason they exist for.
I think the obsession with stats is one of the shot-in-the-foot kind of arrangements, similar to the doctrinal monopoly held by the FDS class. NObody has the slightest idea of how to solve this problem and frankly nobody important in a FDS position cares. It's their end anyway.
Doing away with congregational reports was easy, because there was an easy excuse (competitive attitudes, etc). Of course there are also possible excuses for doing away with the annual ones, but I think it will come as part and parcel of some greater organizational shakeup, perhaps only after the FDS Unicorns cease to exist.
Mary's figures about 1 million leaving since 1997 is wrong...
A 1% death rate for all the seven year since 1997 combined is far too small. It should be more like 1% per year, possibly higher.
I would be surprised if even half a million have left since 1997. Of those some were disfellowshipped, others became inactive for various reasons and a few have disassociated.
So the number who made a pricipled stand to leave will be even fewer still. I can't imagine more than a few thousand since 1997.
I notice that in the January 1st Watchtower they state in a box on page 14 that from now on the Worldwide report will be published in the February 1st Watchtower. I wonder why the change ?
Is there some advantage for timing reasons? Like, slipping bad news in right when people have other things on their minds and aren't paying attention.
I know the Bush administration does this. When labor statistics aren't up to par or there's bad economic news, they like to release the data going into a weekend or a holiday. Most people aren't going to be watching the news or listening to the pundits discuss it over the weekend or while they're doing holiday things. So, the news gets buried and largely unnoticed.
When does the Feb 1 Watchtower actually come out? Within the next couple of weeks? Like, Christmas time maybe? Even though JWs don't celebrate Christmas, their kids get off of school, they have time off of work. Many of them take a vacation. During a vacation, they're not likely to be seriously analyzing anything. All of this is based on the assumption the Feb 1 Watchtower is coming out soon.
I recognize the idea that these numbers are generally not accurate anyway. But, that has probably been being done for a long time and may not really be a factor. If they consistently overstate by 10%, a decline is still going to show up.
The more they lose, the fewer people to knock on doors, the fewer new ones coming in. It means a continued steady decline. If they can see this, then they will take steps to bury that fact. If they are trying to "time" the report so it gets seen by fewer people, that may be a first step. And, as others have pointed out, they may someday get some "new light" saying they shouldn't publish the report.
The idea of them being too overworked to compile the report sounds like bull. Presumably they have everything tabulated and counted because they publish it in the Kingdom Ministry? Have they bumped the Kingdom Ministry reports back a month too? If they have the monthly figures, it shouldn't take long to tabulate the yearly ones. Heck, they've proably even got a spreadsheet that generates the yearly figures automatically.
