Objection by an elder

cnn77

I approached one of the elders with some of my doubts....

I mildly pointed to the fact that the WTBS had been errent in it's prediction of 1975 as well as some of the other "new light" issues.

His response was one which I have heard many times before: "The society is made up of imperfect men. They are not perfect."

Interestingly, in 99% of cases most witnesses will accept this explanation and feel guilty for questining a their fellowman ( the humaistic side of the organisation is unconscioulsy impressed onto the mid of the questioner). At least that is how it has worked on me - until recently.

The next time I am fed this line of reasoning I would like to ask the following question: "OK Brother Elder, I accept that they are not perfect. But if we both acknowledge that they are NOT perfect why will you punish me severely for trying to follow some ideas not sanctioned by the society? If imperfection is acceptable and I have to make allowances for it why can't you leave me alone?"

Anyone else get the gist of what I am trying to say? Has this cop-out answer by the elders been used on you yet? Anyone have any other ideas how I can answer? AM I treading on thin ice?

Monica

Hi CNN!

I get the gist of what you are saying/asking. Regarding what other question might you ask the elder: If I didn't care much for the consequence, I might then say, "Wasn't the Bible written by imperfect men as well? Are there as many errors in the Bible as there are in the WT Publications? I wonder what, in this Watchtower right here, will be changed in 10 years by this 'new light'?"

apostate

Imperfection is not an excuse for everything! Everyone could start a relegion or make a false prophecy and say I am sorry! I am just inperfect.

De 18:18-20 was written to imperfect people, and it leaves no room for mistakes.

Simon

It's the stock answer people use to excuse any manner of wrongdoing. The idea is that they can excuse any behaviour and the society comes out squeeky clean. Like you say though, they won't accept the flip-side that it means we shouldn't believe or accept everything that is said as it is from 'imperfect men'...

They are a bunch of hypocrites like the pharisees..

Lindy

"Has this cop-out answer by the elders been used on you yet?"

so many times, I don't care to think how many. This same excuse has been used on things I have pointed out the the Elders have done to me, my family and many others in the congregations I have been in. One congregations elders in particular had so many crappy elders that they all started avoiding me so I wouldn't bring out more of their faults on how they treated their "flock" with the Societies own publications in my hands for proof of what I said.
I finally just gave up after many years of trying to make the point of how they were damaging so many, young ones and pioneers in particualr. And they wonder why so many left so young? They were blinder than bats when it came to the fact that they were supposed to be sheppards and slaves to the flock and "not lording it over" them.

Lindy

bjc2012

Cnn77,

Why not say: "I thought the faithful slave was led by holy spirit. Why do they need to be perfect if the spirit is teaching them? Jehovah's spirit does not tell lies or get things confused, does it? But then, maybe you shouldn't because they might throw you out for questioning the credentials of your leaders.

bjc

MacHislopp

Hello everyone,

CNN77, a very interesting point!

What you have written happens many times
and almost in every congregation.

I do agree with the logical and true comment of Simon:

1* It's the stock answer people use to excuse any manner of wrongdoing.

2* they won't accept the flip-side that it means we shouldn't believe or accept everything that is said as it is from 'imperfect men'...

and finally the…wrapper: (most of them )…" are a bunch of hypocrites like the pharisees.."

Greetings, J.C.MacHislopp

voltaire

The WTS has the best of both worlds. They demand to be respected and obeyed as though they were infallible, but when they err, they want our patience and understanding.

mustang

BJC2012,

Quite right. With my limited dealings these days, I have heard that "Disrespect for the Elders" has become a major element. It's a great catch-all for the various and sundry minor ailments they have a hard time placing. And they can always make a demand, give you 5 minutes to comply and bust you. Pretty vague and pretty hard to fight.

(My Dad finally got busted back from MS after harassing EVERYONE in sight, Elders included, for 20-some years. Did they bust him on the numerous lies, gossiping and meddling incidents? NO, they used the vague & UNSPECIFIED "Disrespect for the Elders" tool.)

I like what Lindy said and did: nail them with their own petards. This is the way to do it.

I recollect someone in the last few months that legitimately got to call out a couple of Olders on a shepherding call for the congregation being cold and unsociable with their family. Those two left with 'their tail between their legs'. That (and Lindy's method) is the way to go.

If you are going to do this, feign righteous indignation and cry "you stumbled me" loudly!!! Boomerang the guilt ('do more') back onto them.

Mustang
Elders are the pits Class

Enlighted UK

This "excuse" of the society being made up of imperfect men has been used on me MANY times.

One notable occasion; from my book study conductor/field service overseer.

On separate occasions this one man has told me that "it is made of of imperfect men" on another occasion "the organision is perfect", and "the truth is NOT worth losing your marriage over" (thereby implying it is not perfect.

I refused to trust him on anything else from that point on.

It must be sad to be that confused!!

Enlighted UK

Objection by an elder

Share this