Auschwitz: Inside the Nazi State (page 2)

hamsterbait

If the isrealites had Zyclon B then Jehovah would have told them to gas the Canaanites.

WT would be gassing postates if they could.

At the end of the millenium, what more efficient way to get rid of dissenters.

I don't care how disrespectful I sound, but if God told me to kill babies and old women I would refuse. I AM NOT AFRAID ANY MORE (Those words are so empowering).

Before I was annihilated from the whirlwind I would reply that as God has such a superior talent for massacres and killing, why doesn't he just do it himself so much better than I could.

I don't want to live in a world where I have killed children in order to obey God, like the Israelites. I'd rather be dead my way than alive God's way if that's what he wants.

HB

Poztate

Yeah, those dummies defying Hitler. They should have just saluted him along with the rest of the population, huh? Never mind standing up for what's right, that's just "stupid".

They CHOSE TO DIE...serving Rutherford and the WTBTS. Millions never had this opportunity to choose. They died in their millions not knowing anything else. If you want to die for a cause ...no matter how stupid it is don't come whining to me for sympathy.

RIGHT...HAH... Brainwashed BS

glitter

They CHOSE TO DIE...serving Rutherford and the WTBTS. Millions never had this opportunity to choose. They died in their millions not knowing anything else. If you want to die for a cause ...no matter how stupid it is don't come whining to me for sympathy.

It wasn't just *any* cause they died for, they died for refusing to support was *the Nazis*!!

If they had fallen in line and "supported" (real or pretended to) the Nazis then we would all be here on this board with another thing to throw at the WT: we would all be saying the ordinary JWs supported Hitler!

No, the Jews had no choice, even atheist Jews were killed - because it was the race he hated; just like the disabled, they couldn't change that either. If the JWs should have supported the Nazis to save their lives, then should all other groups who suffered that were only following an ideology or practise have? Were they *stupid* too?

I only hope that if I was in that situation, JW or not, that I wouldn't be there smiling with my arm outstretched in a Nazi salute.

Poztate

Yeah... They sure stood up to Hitler...But only when kissing up did not work

The first point made is showing how through letters, tracts, personal testimony, the WTS tried to ameliorate their relationship with the Nazi government by pointing out that the WTS agreed with the German government that the US and UK were evil governments, controlled by the Jews. Basically, that the WTS and the Nazi government had common enemies and that the WTS supported the overall goals of the Nazi government to bring about better conditions for humans. From the JW 1934 Yearbook, page 134-5, these are excerpts of a letter sent to Hitler by the WTS, penned by Rutherford:

The greatest and the most oppressive empire on earth is the Anglo-American empire. By that is meant the British Empire, of which the United States of America forms a part. It has been the commercial Jews of the British-American empire that have built up and carried on Big Business as a means of exploiting and oppressing the peoples of many nations. This fact particularly applies to the cities of London and New York, the stronghold of Big Business. This fact is so manifest in America that there is a proverb concerning the city of New York which says: The Jews own it, the Irish Catholics rule it, and the Americans pay the bills.

The present government of Germany has declared emphatically against Big Business oppressors and in opposition to the wrongful religious influence in the political affairs of the nations. Such is exactly our position.

Instead of being against the principles advocated by the government of Germany, we stand squarely for such principles, and point out that Jehovah God through Christ Jesus will bring about the full realization of these principles and will give to the people peace and prosperity and the greatest desire of every honest heart.

A careful examination of our books and literature will disclose the fact that the very high ideals held and promulgated by the present national government are set forth in and endorsed and strongly emphasized in our publications and show that Jehovah God will see to it that these high ideals in due time will be attained by all persons who love righteousness[?]

czarofmischief

The present government of Germany has declared emphatically against Big Business oppressors and in opposition to the wrongful religious influence in the political affairs of the nations. Such is exactly our position.

The letter from Rutherford, in addition to being as astounding a piece of racist appeasement claptrap as I have ever heard, is patently wrong in so many areas. I wonder if Rutherford wasn't trying to lay the groundwork for eventual Nazi victory? He made several talks indicating that the Germans would win, I recall from CoC.

Was Rutherford a Nazi sympathizer?

CZAR

glitter

Yes. I know about the 1934 yearbook. It's appalling - and so is giving in to evil like that regime in *any* way.

I am not a JW anymore and certainly no fan of Rutherford. But I just think this is one issue in particular where I can't bring myself to critisise the ordinary JWs in *any* way - like I said, I hope I would have had the strength myself in that situation.

But *do* you think it was *stupid* of other groups targetted to not renounce their ideology too?

Poztate

But *do* you think it was *stupid* of other groups targetted to not renounce their ideology too?

They died for following a flawed cult...They were brainwashed (stupid?) to die for their religious god...much the same as Jim Jones cult or the Branch Dividian. They had a choice to live or follow their cult to their death. The suicide bombers of today follow their ideology also. They are fighting against the "great satan" the USA but I do not commend them for following their religious ideology to their death.

As far as the other groups.

Jews....no choice

Political...no choice

Homosexual...no choice

I see you have strong opinions on this subject as I do also.You will not change my opinions and I am sure you will not be moved to change yours. This is my last post on this subject.

glitter

The political prisoners could have denied their beliefs and supported the Nazis just as easily as the JWs - political and religous beliefs aren't something a person is born with unlike being Jewish, a Gypsy or a homosexual.

I'm not going to let my *strong* dislike of the JW movement cloud my judgement - I cannot bring myself to say supporting Hitler would have been a good idea.

fairchild

I recently wrote a tribute to Anne Frank. Before starting to write it, I did some research regarding her background and the holocaust. I made it through two evenings of reading up on the holocaust subject. The third evening I started crying and couldn't stop. I hardly ever cry.

Auschwitz: Inside the Nazi State

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