marriage outside of JW (page 2)

Doubtfully Yours

Yes. However, it'll cost him or her plenty of privileges within the WTBTS, and a lot of grief from the elders.

DY

TMS

Marrying outside the congregation has never been a disfellowshipping offense. One might be marked. Privileges witheld. But not disfellowshipped for that alone.

tms

undercover

I'm a little confused. Are you currently married? Did she get pregnant before you were married and she was DFd for that?

JWs do not DF for marrying an unbeliever. They strongly advise against it, and even "mark" ones that do it. "Mark" means to look at one as spiritually weak, maybe limiting social contact with such ones. The admonition of not marrying an unbeliever is very harsh, especially to those who may hear it and are not believers. Things have been said in their assembly talks such as "Marrying an unbeliever is the same as marrying a corpse", because they teach that Armageddon is imminent and only JWs will survive, so why bother marrying someone who's going to die.

Sex outside of marriage is forbidden and is a DFing offense. If you confess or someone squeels on you to the elders, you will face punishment. If you are repentant(cry and beg forgiveness and swear it was a stupid mistake) or if you can fake it good enough, you will only be reproved, either privately or publicly. Private reproof means certain priviledges are taken away but no announcement is made that you sinned. Public reproof means an announcement is made to the congregation to let everyone know that this person gravely sinned. Sometimes if the sin is too well known, as in pregnancy happens after fornication, they will DF to show the congregation that the situation has been dealt with.

If she's trying to regain a good standing in the congregation and you haven't married yet, they will strongly advise her to not marry you. To marry you, an unbeliever, is sinning against God. If she's already DFd but wanting to get reinstated they will not allow her as long as she is dating you or living with you. Once she marries you, they will wait several months or a year and if she tows the line enough by going to all the meetings and maybe even studying again, she will then be allowed to come back. You will then be considered an "unbelieving mate" by the other JWs and they may be nice to you, but they will never accept you. It's like being a second class citizen. The wife may also suffer because she chose to marry you and they may never trust her completely again and they will keep a close eye on her.

Good luck. You're gonna need it, I'm thinking.

beebee

Paradox, if I remember pregnancy and early motherhood (my oldest is nearing 18 so it has been a while), I found that even while pregnant I became very protective of my child and changed in many ways to reflect that. For example, I became obsessive about wearing a seat belt in the car (years before it became law to). I also called the IRS to tell them I wanted to settle and old debt (big mistake..don't ever do this).

I am not, nor have ever been a JW, but from what I am learning from my partner and these boards, is that the JWs believe that you must be a member in good standing in order to be resurrected after Armageddon, and that if you don't believe and act accordingly, you are doomed to Hell. As a mother, it makes sense to protect your children, and for a JW mom, that includes protecting their soul and their eternity. Hence her need to get back into the fold, even if it means excluding you, makes sense if you consider this belief.

She may well still love you, but her overriding need to protect her baby is winning. Also, depending upon her relationship with her family, she may feel the need to be closer to them, and to do that, she may have to be in the church.

At least that is what I suspect may be going on. Perhaps you can ask her. Getting her to assess her feelings honestly is a good start. IF this is the case, then you can figure out what your next path is. As to getting her to see the light and not go back, I can't offer any advice there as I haven't a clue. As an outsider it seems so illogical to me, but you're in a good place to ask those questions for many here have been through it.

However none of it looks optimistic. I will say though, if her goal in going back is to protect her child, it may prove to be the foundation by which the two of you can reach some agreements to keep you in YOUR child's life as that is in the baby's best interest, even if the church doesn't see it that way. Kids need both parents and many couples on these boards where one partner is in and one is out, have reached a compromise so they can coparent effectively.

The JellyBaby

How would it stand if a baptized person, was to marry an unbaptized person. Would they still be pulled up, as marrying 'not in the lord'????

paradox213

beebee, "As a mother, it makes sense to protect your children, and for a JW mom, that includes protecting their soul and their eternity. Hence her need to get back into the fold, even if it means excluding you, makes sense if you consider this belief. " How can she be protecting her our kid? She is vastly depriving him of his right to have a father. Excluding me is the most selfish thing. "She may well still love you, but her overriding need to protect her baby is winning." If you love someone you would never go out of your way to NOT work things out. "At least that is what I suspect may be going on. Perhaps you can ask her." She can't speak to me in erson alone w/out chaperone She doesn't want to work this out, I'm judging by her actions..not her words. Thanks for your input

Bec

Actually - it is not a disfellowshipping offense to marry outside the truth, but the elders will warn you against it... I married a non believer and was just cautioned against it... Since then been, divorced and now I am df'd because I decided to follow my heart and I am in a same sex marriage...I am a lesbian....

paradox213

undercover, She wasn't we were never married. she/we got pregnant= she bailed out, left me. I want/ed to marry her and be there for her and the lil boy. She doesn't care about anything regarding the lil dude's future.

beebee

I'm sorry to hear but as you've gathered from the others, she's under enormous pressure to steer clear of you. When is the baby due? I have no idea what state you are in but in any of the 50 US states, you have rights as a father she cannot deny you. Once the baby is born, she must allow visitation, though she can play games and try to block you before he's born. Talk to a lawyer. Most will meet with you for the initial consultation for free. If you are in CA, a lot of the county family courts have clinics where they are staffed with people who will help you file your papers for free (they can't give legal advice though so you should still talk to a lawyer first).

In a nutshell, you will likely be ordered to pay child support, and she will have to give visitation. In many states, joint custody is almost the given and you can certainly ask for joint custody. In some states they split "legal" custody (the right to sign legal documents such as school papers or a hospital admission form) and "physical" (where they primarily live) custody. For example I have joint legal custody and sole physical custody of my girls. These days it would have more likely been joint on both issues. You need the legal custody for emergency purposes. You won't likely get sole physical custody unless she is incapable of taking proper care of the child, and that's a tough burden to prove. I don't recommend trying unless there's a darn good reason. Breast feeding is not a reason to limit your visitation. Even breast fed babies can take a bottle some of the time.

You will likely have to prove legal paternity. She can admit you are the father or be a jerk and make you prove it with a test. Some states will order you both into mediation to figure out custody and visitation. If they don't require it, I recommend you insist on it. That way you have a professional, neutral party who can help reinforce to her that, like it or not, you are the dad and your baby needs you in his life too.

It can be an emotionally wrenching task when one parent tries to deny the other. If she continues to try to exclude you, many jurisdictions will allow you to take custody. They can also order her into counseling, etc.

Use the time between now and then to educate yourself on your rights and your local legal processes. Make sure you have your own life in order and are equipped to father your child. Believe in yourself and you'll make it through.

Didn't you say in one post she IS 18, or is she really below legal age? If she's 18, then only she can stop you from talking alone.

paradox213

Beebee, baby is due may 29. my ex gf is 21. Why would ANY relgios group want the father of the baby to be avoided?! This is my problem, she's actually NOT seeing what is happening. She "currently" speaks as though I can and will be able to see our son when I want to. Thanks again...

marriage outside of JW

Share this