Hello, I need a few JW views on a couple of bible verses. Thanks! (page 2)

jgnat

Chance, another thing to try to fix the formatting...copy the whole mess in to Wordpad, fix the editing, and repaste it in.

I'm not jw nor ever was / will be, but I'll take this opportunity to point out something in jw understanding - note that pericumeus above states in reasoning "But every time remembering the clear truth that I pointed out above" - start there, at the 'clear truth' part - it jwism goes wrong where the foundations lie - literally.

jgnat

Yup, yup, yup. "clear truth", fuzzy "truth". By the way, Simon, thanks for fixing the formatting! My eyes thank you, my bifocals thank you!

holly

Welcome Chance. You have lots of knowledge and lost me a bit. lots of words and i get lost easily.

Ive had burning questions for as long as i can remember about things that dont add up. if youve ever read the King James version, John 1.1, it says 'in the beginning was the word and the word was with god and the word was god'. New World translation says '...and the word was a god'. One simple word, but it changes Jesus from being God, to being less than God.

all very confusing.

hope this site brings answers

NewLight2

holly,

Check out my web page about Johannes Greber. I think that it will answer your question about why the NWT has the little 'a' before God in John 1:1

JerichoForce

Chance

Don't worry made the same mistake, Glitter was the one who had fun pointing that out, something to do with a bike...

Anyway, just flew through this post so this is just a quick reply.

To add to what you said we have the following statement from Jesus about his identity as the great I AM of the Old Testament and thus what we have is His claim that he and God are one and the same, compare this to what we see throughout the Old Testament

John 8:58 - Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am

Exodus 3:13 And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.

In Genesis 1:1 the Bible begins by saying ?In the beginning ELOHIYM?" The word Elohiym in Hebrew is the plural of the word ?God? (Eloi). Therefore, in the very first sentence of the Bible it tells us that in the beginning the GODS (Eloihiym) created the earth. As we read a little further in the first chapter of the Bible, we see that when God speaks He says ?let US..? That is correct language if one person is talking to one or more other people. However, it is incorrect if God is talking to Himself. Some say that God was talking to the angels. If that is so, then when Adam and Eve partook of the forbidden fruit God why would God state ?Man is become as one of us?? A little later on in the first book of the Bible, during the time when the tower of Babel was being built, God said "Let US go down to confound their language." It seems very strange to me that God would have invited the angels to help Him perform this act when He could have done it all by Himself.

To me it seems clear that Jesus and God were clearly of a singular but (along with the Holy Spirit) triune Godhead, united in purpose and being, thus there is no contradicition in God raising his Son from the dead

Chance

Thank you for the warm-welcome everyone! Many good points indeed. And no, I didn't notice that most of you are Ex-JW. I assumed this was a JW website and would consist of mostly JW.

Pericusmeus, gives me the same distinct type of reasoning I always encounter with JW teachings & discussions. I applaud JW?s approach to try and simplify our understanding. Everyone needs to start with the basics. And JWs do that well? kind of. From first impression a lot of JW teachings seem so simple and easy to understand, however it?s these simplified explanations that sometimes seems to overlook some of gods greater understanding. After all, ?God works in mysterious ways?. The human mind and understanding (in our present state) cannot possibly understand the complexities of God?s knowledge. Maybe our soul can, but not our limited minds. That?s why, sometimes our mind says one thing but our heart says another.

You said: ?While Jesus was dead, Jehovah was alive and he resurrected him?, implying they are ?separate persons?, and ?that at one time, one of them was alive and the other one dead?.

?remembering the clear truth?; Jesus being dead for 3 days and Jehovah being eternal does not clearly indicate that they are separate persons! It simply implies that the physical body of Jesus was dead and brought back to life (Jesus? spirit never died). The ?clear truth? is that God can be in full omnipotent control of the universe (as usual) and live a full human life simultaneously. God doesn?t have they same type of limitations that we have. Our physical bodies cannot be in two places at once. But God is always everywhere. In the spirit realm, in the physical realm, and in our own hearts & minds.
God could easily maintain his heavenly presence and live a human life. Why wouldn?t he?

This type of thinking gives my mind a real workout! And when discussed can be quite confusing to others.

It?s so difficult to take such complexities and put them into a few words. So when I?ve had bible studies with JWs in the past, I asked so many questions and the outcome has always been the same. I organize our collective conclusions and they imply something other than what the JW originally tried to prove. Then they get frustrated and resort to insisting that I believe something they were taught that ultimately isn?t accurate. Then we change the subject to try to avoid frustrating arguments.

I do completely agree with you (Pericusmeus) about not identifying God?s people by doctrines. Intelligence and knowledge do not equal a true follower of God. Judgment will be equally fair for everyone. And we will not be judged by our works or scriptural knowledge but by our hearts and our loyalty to God. Example: if a JW doesn?t celebrate Christmas because he feels its pagan and it would be disobedient to God. Then I?m sure God loves his/her obedience/sacrifice. Likewise, if I teach my children there is no Santa Clause, and we celebrate our appreciation of Jesus, each other, and our lives we are also in Gods will.

Note: I acknowledge there is a WRONG (secular) way to celebrate a holiday.

P.S.
Paduan, you had a typo or something. I didn't quite understand your point.

Chance

holly,

You mentioned John 1:1 "In the beginning was the word and the word was with god and the word was god'. New World translation says '...and the word was a god'. One simple word, but it changes Jesus from being God, to being less than God."

Basicly...

In the beginning was ME, MYSELF and I.

LOL

Hello, I need a few JW views on a couple of bible verses. Thanks!

stillajwexelder

seeitallclearlynow

jgnat

A Paduan

jgnat

holly

NewLight2

JerichoForce

Chance

Chance

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