would you think this scripture could be used for religious tolerance?

by candidlynuts 15 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  candidlynuts

  mark 9: 38-40 NWT

  38 John said to him: ?Teacher, we saw a certain man expelling demons by the use of your name and we tried to prevent him, because he was not accompanying us.? 39 But Jesus said: ?Do not try to prevent him, for there is no one that will do a powerful work on the basis of my name that will quickly be able to revile me; 40 for he that is not against us is for us.

  KJV

  38 And John answered him, saying, Master, we saw one casting out devils in thy name, and he followeth not us: and we forbad him, because he followeth not us.

  39 But Jesus said, Forbid him not: for there is no man which shall do a miracle in my name, that can lightly speak evil of me.

  40 For he that is not against us is on our part.
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  the_classicist

  NAB notes:

  Jesus warns against jealousy and intolerance toward others, such as exorcists who do not follow us. The saying in Mark 9:40 is a broad principle of the divine tolerance. Even the smallest courtesies shown to those who teach in Jesus' name do not go unrewarded.
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  barry

  I beleive it is a teaching against intollerance.

  The true church is all those who trust in the merits of christ, and is not any single denomination.
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  Country_Woman

  strange: reading the topic, I was thinking at this text and then, when opening, it appeared to be the same .....

  Yes......... think you are right (and me too)
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  Ticker

  Classicist qouted a reference:

  Jesus warns against jealousy and intolerance toward others

  It's too bad most organized religions of the past and present didn't see it this way.

  Jealousy and intolerance are trademarks of any organized religion, even though many may start out with christian freedom as was portrayed in the first century among Christ's followers, human weaknesses soon set in and authority, jealousy, and intolerance of others soon follows. This too can be noted from the history of the Watchtower, starting as free thought bible study groups and in less then a hundred years becoming the militant authority structure it is today. The same application can be paralleled from the founding of the Catholic(universal) church, even though being supposedly universal it very quickly in the second century c.e. became an intolerant authority structure. Whats alarming is even though ones independent of a man made or man run organization but viewing Christ soley as their rightful head are often shown the same intolerance by the Watchtower as ones trying to serve their master Christ free from Catholic dogmatism in the 2cd century. They have rapidly took on the face of post apostolic authority structures and abandoned the true freedom in Christ, while yet trying to display a first century image in which they sadly fall far short of.

  Ticker
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  in a new york bethel minute

  one time i used that scripture off the top of my head to a witness and he swore up and down that jesus said, "he that is not for us is against us"... goes to show their mentality... and the person who said it is a very tolerant, non-judgemental person...

  bethel sight
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  peacefulpete

  In a new york bethel minute....Q does have Jesus say, "The one not with me is against me, and the one not gathering with me scatters." (Matt12:30, Lukeb 11:23)

  This does stand in contrast with mark 9:40 , " Whoever is not against us is for us".

  These two sources represent two different communities of Christians. However even in GMark sectarianism is evident. Even tho the Jesus of the nT has many faces, he was never depicted as outstandingly tolerant.
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  Valis

  Don't forget Luke 9:49
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  Buster

  I've seen Mark 9:40 referred to in WTS pubs before. But I'm not certain I've seen it quoted. Anyway, believe it or not, they use it to spout intollerance - even though it speaks the exact opposite. If JWs could force themselves to actually look up some of the myriad of scripture references embedded in their tripe in due season, they may someday see how many are actually misquotes. They just might see that many of those scriptures really say the exact opposite.

  As far as other scriptures that seem to stand in contrast, Luke 11 for example, I suspect that has more to do with subtleties in transalation. Either way, I like it when scriptures seem to contradict each other. I consider that to be the strongest indication that we need to seek balance, understand, and decide for ourselves - that whole independant thought thing.
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  peacefulpete

  Good point Valis, Luke used both Mark and Q and so retains both expressions. Matty dropped Mark's saying and retained only the Q expression for reasons of his own. Compare mark 9:33-41 with Matt 18:1-5 and Luke 9:46-50) Matt apparently saw the saying because he uses the conclusion from mark (9:41) in another setting (Matt 10:42)