Guns and JWs (page 7)

Dan-O

"What the second amendment can be argued to mean in context Myth of the Second Amendment"

Yes, I am unfortunately familiar with Brady's tragic injuries at the hands of John Hinckly and his subsequent promotion to poster child for the gun control movement. I disagree strongly with the fallacies presented on that website.

"Secondly, "large caliber" to me means ballistics larger than what has legitamate use in hunting North American game animals."

So, a .44 magnum or a .357 or a 9 mm or a 300 Weatherby Magnum or pretty much anything up to a .58 caliber are all still acceptable? "North american game animals" include deer, elk, moose, bison, and bears. And These aren't the kinds of animals you want to take down with a bolt action single shot .22 caliber rifle. Keep in mind, too, that most of these "small caliber" rounds are still significantly larger than the ammunition that an AK-47 or an SKS or an M-16 fires.

"Thirdly the 1994 ban on automatic weapons was not renewed"

I'm not talking about that weak-kneed piece of 'feel good' legislation. I'm talking about the National Firearms Act of 1934 which tightly controlled the ownership and transfers of ownership for automatic weapons.

EvilForce

Well as I've stated... I'm not pro or anti gun at all so don't have a dog in this hunt.

However,,, I think you must admit that the countries that have gun bans as indicated in the numbers I posted above showing the US in the lead, our current laws let the US lead in murders.

If you want no additional moves to be made then just say that the 14 murders per 100,000 is ok in your book. It's an "acceptable price" to pay for total freedom.

Also, the NRA never, ever will give an inch. Not a limitation on gun show sales... nothing. So it's a bit disingenius when I hear "enforce the current laws" first. Why are those laws NOT being enforced in your opinion?

avishai

Evilforce, check out switzerlands numbers for violent crime. And gun related crime.

EvilForce

Switzerland's rate is about 1/3 ours. And yes Switzerland is awash in guns seeing as each male must serve in the military as they are a neutral country. So what exactly are you trying to say Avi? I'm missing your point somehow :( Switzerland is also a country with a narrow band of socio-economic divergence.

And maybe I haven't made MY point clear. I think our gun rate is way too high. I'm not sure of the best way of dealing with this...bans...licensing...I think TRAINING is a no brainer. Want a gun, pass a test. For crying out loud you need a driver's license and a car can kill just as effectively as a gun. But most PRO GUN people hide behind the "enforce the laws" and want nothing else added. I say our current system is broken....what can we do to fix it?

Now you may say you don't think it's broken, and that's ok. We'll just have to disagree. But I've also been responsible for putting people back together again after gun shot wounds...not pretty. I see the horror it brings a family. I'd like to see SOMETHING done that would help. And I'd much rather repair a knife wound than a GSW, for the record :)

When I walk around the streets of Tokyo I feel safe. When I walk the streets of Prague I feel safe. When I walk my own downtown streets in this country I do not always feel safe.

avishai

Switzerland's rate is about 1/3 ours. And yes Switzerland is awash in guns seeing as each male must serve in the military as they are a neutral country. So what exactly are you trying to say Avi? I'm missing your point somehow :( Switzerland is also a country with a narrow band of socio-economic divergence.

And maybe I haven't made MY point clear. I think our gun rate is way too high. I'm not sure of the best way of dealing with this...bans...licensing...I think TRAINING is a no brainer. Want a gun, pass a test. For crying out loud you need a driver's license and a car can kill just as effectively as a gun.

I think that about covers my position. I think an armed society is a GREAT idea. Nobody messes with swizerland. That's why they can remain neutral. But........Training is very necessary.

But most PRO GUN people hide behind the "enforce the laws" and want nothing else added

Most? Maybe a lot, but unfortuanately I think it's mainly just the most VOCAL element of the pro gun folks. Very few of us want idiots with guns running around, and or criminals.

EvilForce

I think that's why the bans come around. The "liberals" if you will, don't see the NRA, the gun manufacturer's or anyone else being very responsible or putting forth and "real alternatives". So if the "pro gun" lobby doens't change it's tactics soon, I think there will be another school shooting, etc, that will finally put the nail in everyone's rights. Even the republican's will be forced to bend.

cab1000

I grew up in a state that did not allow weapons to be concealed carry. I had always thought that to be wrong. Now I live in Indiana, and one of the first things I did when I moved here was purchase my concealed carry permit. I hardly ever carry, but I feel great about the ABILITY to do so. That, to me, is what freedom is.

BTW, I have a 12 gauge shot gun under my bed, loaded but not cocked. I also have a Pheonix .22 pistol, and it is a hoot to shoot.

In all the congregations I have attended, it would be a no no to say you had a gun. I think there is a "dont ask dont tell" about guns...

~cab

avishai

think that's why the bans come around. The "liberals" if you will, don't see the NRA, the gun manufacturer's or anyone else being very responsible or putting forth and "real alternatives

Strangely, one thing the "liberals" if you will usually leave out is that the NRA is on the front lines of responsibility in setting out trainig courses for gun safety in almost any city.

EvilForce

yes but they fight licensing ...... I really don't think the NRA is an honest broker

PinTail

I asked an elder once concerning self defense and or guns, if he would fight to ward off an intruder or take his life in the event of a threat to his wife, he said no. At that I said to him then call me! and I will come over and defend her.

Guns and JWs

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