Grandparents give grandson ultimatum

EscapedLifer1

Greetings all,

This is Brandon Bartlett, formerly 2escaped Lifers here on the forum.

Quick background: Myself, wife, and two boys (10 and 12), left the borg together about three years ago. Were DA'd a little over a year ago. Both my parents and family and my wife's parents are still "pillars" in their respective congregations. We were "perfect" little JW family, MS about to be appointed Elder, wife a pioneer, all that. Both sets of families consider us apostate and will have nothing to do with us, except that the grandparents want to see our boys from time to time.

We've had several arguments with them about them studying with the kids while visiting them, taking out in service, etc. Boys, thankfully, are becoming immune to the crap (even though we indoctrinated them rather well while in, regretfully). So, here's what happens this afternoon:

My wife's parents want the boys for the weekend. So we meet them at public spot (yeah, they are that scared of us) for them to pick up the boys. Our youngest stays in the truck when we all meet, so I go back to the truck to see what's wrong. He is getting upset, and says that he doesn't want to go to the meeting tomorrow (Sunday) morning, but he doesn't want to hurt their feelings. I tell him that he can still go visit, that he doesn't have to go to the meeting, perhaps they can just let him stay home and watch TV.

We get out of the truck and talk to her parents about this. Grandfather says that he does not want to leave our 10-1/2 year old home alone for three hours, its not safe (yet they both stay home alone quite often for a few hours at a time as they are both emotionally and physically very mature for their ages). Grandfather says that if our son comes over to visit, he will have to go to the meeting with them.

My wife and I walk off a few steps to talk privately with our son about it. He is upset, because he loves his grandparents but does NOT want to go to the meeting. He doesn't understand why they won't let him stay home by himself a little while (by the way, where they live is a very safe place, surrounded by plenty of old relatives and acquaintances in a small town close knit neighborhood). I ask our son if he can just put up with a couple hours of their crap in order to visit the weekend, and he thinks about it a while and says no, he can't.

So, I walk back to the grandparents and say something like 'why does this have to be an ultimatum, about going to the meeting. Why can't he just stay at your house and watch TV for a while?'

Grandfather: frowns, looks away, and says in a disgusted voice "I hate it when you all put me in a position like this!"

My wife: "We aren't putting you in any positon, he want's to visit for the weekend, he just doesn't want to go to the meeting."

My wife and her mother talk a little (I forget most of their conversation, because I am mad and I'm watching her father frown and pout). Finally Grandfather decides to put his foot down, and forcefully says that if our son wants to come visit, he is going to the meeting. He's not going to stay home alone because they are scheduled to take out the speaker for lunch.

We tell our son its up to him, and he finally decides not to go. Our older son decides to still go, he wants to visit. So as we are saying our goodbyes Grandfather tells our youngest in a pitiful guilt-trip voice, "I'm sorry you don't want to come with us, we miss you so much."

I almost lose it at this point, but somehow maintain my composure because I don't want to cause a scene and upset the boys with a big argument.

It continues to boggle my mind how these folks can think that their conduct is righteous and loving, and I used to be one of them. Their control issues and their blind ignorant belief that if our boys are exposed to the occassional meeting they will somehow come back to "The Truth" are stunning. How they are able to turn the situation around in their mind and blame us for the situation, rather than their ultimatum, is beyond me.

Sorry, just had to vent some. Thanks for listening!

Brandon

avishai

((((brandon)))

IMO, and the opinion of almost any psychiatrist, it's nut's to let your kids around people who refuse to speak to their parents. Sorry, but it gives your kids the idea that it's alright for people to shit on you. Don't do it. If theri gonna shun you, don't let them have access to your kids, i know it hurts, but cut the rope. In the long run it's wayyy better.

simplesally

I would probably let my parents see my child, even if JW's, but not allow any religious indoctrination, including going to meetings. For me, I would say, spend the night, I will pick them up in the morning. Kiss Kiss, see ya later.

purplesofa

I am glad you did not force the child that did not want to go to go. I have had to pick my duaghter up from my Mom's earlier than I was supposed to because a visit did not go well(she lives three hours away)

I let my daughter see her grandmother even though we no longer have a relationship. But, her animosity towards me was shown to my daughter. My mother telling her we were not real JW's and this that and the other. My mom would talk bad about me. This really upset my daughter. Anyway, she does not go anymore, My mom ruined the relationship.

I have a friend that her daughter went to see Grandparents and also had to be picked up much earlier than planned(1000 miles away) and the girl has not really been the same since the visit. Alot of talk about destruction at Armegeddon and such. She would never really tell the mother about the whole visit. She became suicidal about 6 months after visit and is in therapy. The mother thinks the visit was a catalyst for this.

We just have to remember that this is a cult and some of the people that go there, ok most, ok ALL, have distorted thinking. and protect our children from it. They really say and do hurtful things.

avishai

I would probably let my parents see my child, even if JW's, but not allow any religious indoctrination, including going to meetings. For me, I would say, spend the night, I will pick them up in the morning. Kiss Kiss, see ya later.

Riiighhtt. NO JW would go behind a parents back and indoctrinate their grandkids, especially if in their pea-brains it meant their grandkids very lives. That would never happen. Sorry, If im not good enough for you to talk too, neither are my kids. No goddamn way, period, not a chance in hell. I went THROUGH to much of this shit AS a kid. How many folks on this board alone have had their kids turned against them by JW grandparents? I know of at least two examples. And that's not even what I'm talking about.. But that risk DOES exist. What I am talking about is giving your kids mixed messages. "Honey, it's OK for these people to abuse me as much as they want and still have access to you." It's very similar to someone who stays around an abusive spouse and plays the martyr. Letting a kid watch their parents get abused is VERY HARMFUL!!

garybuss

My kid would go to stay with an active Witness over my dead body.

avishai

Thank you for summing up what I meant to say so succinctly Gary.

Mary

Grandfather says that if our son comes over to visit, he will have to go to the meeting with them.

Brandon, this is awful! However, you have to remember that YOU have the upper hand here---not them. This can be a difficult thing, arguing with parents because we were taught to love and respect and listen to them. In this case however, you need to stand your ground.

In my opinion, if both families are refusing to have anything to do with you and your wife, I personally would not allow the grandkids to spend ANY time with them alone. I guarantee you that they will try some really sneaky, subtle and not-so-subtle ways of trying to preach to your kids and to turn them against you guys. When you 've got family members who put the religion before family and have no hesitation in cutting you off like that, then for god's sake, don't give them ANY lee-way or benefit of the doubt. There's countless stories of this stuff happening and I know a friend of mine who's going through this exact same stuff. His bitch of an ex-mother-in-law told her 9 year old granddaughter that she's going to die at Armageddon because she doesn't go to the Kingdumb Hell. The kid just freaked out, thinking Jehovah was going to strike her dead right then and there. Needless to say, my friend won't let her go back there and the old bitch is threatening to go to court to get custody......she's a wacko old woman and there's no chance that any court would give her custody of an abandonned dog, let alone a human being, but this is the sort of mentality that goes on.

You and your wife need to discuss this, but in my opinion, you need to tell your parents and your in-laws that they won't be making the decisions---YOU will be and if they don't like it, then guess what, they don't see the grandkids, plain and simple.

This can be hard to do, but from the conversation you described, it certainly sounds as though they're trying to rule the roost and tell YOU what they're going to do. You need to put your foot down now and let them know that you will not put up with their crap.

bisous

ditto.

If they want to see your kids, let them come to your house and spend the time with them there. Accompanied by you or your wife.

avishai

If they want to see your kids, let them come to your house and spend the time with them there. Accompanied by you or your wife.

And treat you well at your house. No shunning.

Grandparents give grandson ultimatum

Share this