Is it better to just LEAVE or FIGHT?

by ljwtiamb 48 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

• 

  Lois

  ljwtiamb	Is it better to just LEAVE or FIGHT?	May 23, 2005
  	Which will give you the most satisfaction? How much more damage will we (you and/or I) endure, if the chosen path is in vain? Just thinking! (maybe too much!) Thinking on your own is the road to recovery. The J.W. organization is fearful of you or any member that dares to use their own resources because they know you'll find out the deception of their teachings.
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  doofdaddy

  Yeah move on. As I get back from another adventure, I occasionally run in to exfriends who are still jws. They are old fat and stuck. I used to feel sorry for them and give them a few mental tidbits to chew on but now treat them as disfellowshipped, don't give them the time of day, ha ha. Works both ways
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  JohnHag

  You can have both-I left after 32 years--I quit on my own--Then i read the books of Ray Franz and Diane Wilson--That was it--I now have a degree on Jehovahs Witness--There are 2 elders right down the street from me--They wont dare come to talk to me because i sent word that i would talk to one only--They want 2 so they have me--I have not been DFD or DA--If i ever receive a letter from them i will return to sender--If i get a registered letter i also refuse it--If they do anything to me i will only know if someone tells me so--Yes you can have both--But you have to be alert- I owe them people nothing--They are very cold people--Love is conditional--And that makes their love phoney--I have not been to a meeting in 2 years--I have not heard anything--I know that they know that i have found out a lot-They dont want to get involved--I have let it be known that i will not be a Ray Franz--I will be a 6 pack Joe--I dont mean by violence--I mean with my mouth--All the things i have found out--All you know what it is--Their old books--Their old magazines--Ray Franz- Edwart Chitty--Leo Greenlees- Percy Chapman--The UN-- I could go on and on--I am now 69 years of age and i get my high on talking about them and drinking a little of blush wine--I have nothing to lose-Am i mad? You are dam right im mad- Thirty two years of brainwashing--My children never had a holiday--All the money i spent on gas- going and coming--Torture at the summer assemblies---Depression on not getting there on time-Seeing people taken to the back room--How could i have been so stupid--Go ahead have it both ways--Dont go by any of their rules by DA yourself--That will close the books on you--Thats what they want to do is close or open the book on you--Fight back--Its your turn now--Hag
• 

  hillbilly

  Fight... their rules. They have the high ground and defend the battleground. Bold frontal assaults on your part will only make the Jdubs close ranks and ignore-shun you. Now, of course that doesnt mean they won...but it neutralizes your efforts.

  Bonus---if you are agressive enough THEY will toss you out on your ear...and your life will begin.

  If you want to fight a underground war..be an insurgent in their midst. This take some stealth, patience and some plausible deniability on your part. You have to be cautious as a serpent and gently as a lamb. If you can keep your cool you may be able to get some folks to think for yourself before you are captured. Can be a lot of fun if your sorta a natural smart-ass kinda person who wears a little Teflon.

  Bonus-- after a while you will confide in a rat... THEY will toss you out on your ear....and your life will begin.

  Really, leave or fight, is an issue that depend soley on your ability to digest bullSh*t and the loss of family issue.

  Remember ..this mission is yours only if you choose to accept it. Happy Hunting.

  ~Hill
• 

  Dogpatch

  I took a year and a half off after leaving to become a normal person again, not telling others of my background. But then, the strong feeling rose up inside me to tell the world what happened at Bethel in 1979-1980, as Ray had not printed his book yet.

  Testimony of Randall Watters

  (served at Watchtower headquarters from 1974 to 1980)

  Having been a pioneer for two years and anxious to live at the hub of "God's organization," Bethel seemed like a wonderful place to be. From the start, I learned to run a press, printing the New World Translation, the Aid book, and many other publications. By 1977 I had been appointed a floor overseer and a Bethel elder. I was in charge of the presses that printed their Bibles, and help start an offset printing training school. Later projects involved helping to renovate the entire printing operation. Traveling regularly around New England as a speaker, I made many fine friends and enjoyed my work. I was convinced this was truly "God's organization," and was even zealous to report those who were entertaining thoughts contrary to those of the "faithful slave." I was well-known as an "organization man."

  The big change in my perspective came in early 1979. On a business trip to Massachusetts with three other factory overseers, we were discussing the importance of faith for salvation and how the organization makes one's works the big issue (rather than true faith) through the counting of time (going door-to-door), keeping personal activity records, etc. From this time I began a study that intrigued me more and more, as I studied Paul's letters to the Romans and Galatians. At Bethel, I attended a Monday night Bible study after the family "Watchtower study." We used different translations of the Bible and went through the New Testament chapter by chapter. It was becoming noticeable to those within our group that there was a significant difference between studying what the Watchtower said about the Bible and actually studying the Bible.

  Word leaked out that the Governing Body had discussed the validity of the 1914 date; or, rather, the issue was brought up for discussion but was quickly dropped. Also, the matter of the importance of developing one's conscience rather than living by a code of rules had been repeatedly brought up, and it seemed that a measure of freedom would be tolerated within the organization. Articles had been published that appeared to give the Witnesses more freedom in their consciences as to matters of employment and their private lives.

  Take as an example the Oct. 1, 1972 Watchtower article on "Your Conscience and Your Employment." It was clarified that a person who worked on a tobacco plantation could choose to remain there or quit his job; it was up to his conscience. Then not a few months would pass by, and elders would complain to the Governing Body that the flock was taking too many liberties, and rules had to be laid down. Thus, the Kingdom Ministry of September 1976 stated on page 3 that a Witness most certainly "could not engage in the manufacture, sale or promotion" of cigarettes. Milton Henschel, a member of the Governing Body, once said over another matter of conscience, "If we let the brothers do this, there is no telling how far they will go." While in direct conflict with Paul's words at Romans 7:6 and Galatians 2:16-21; 3:10, the Governing Body deemed it necessary to lay down rules to "keep the brothers in line." Over and over I would hear it echoed among those in positions of responsibility at Bethel, "You just can't trust the brothers to themselves." In other words, the average JW's love for Jehovah was seemingly not able to keep him out of trouble, he needed to have rules, curfews and restrictions to govern all aspects of his life. Yet, my experience as an overseer told me otherwise. When you trust people, they feel comfortable and work all the more to get the job done. Unfortunately, this was not the pervading atmosphere at Bethel.

  Up until the latter part of 1979, personal opinions could be discussed among close friends, and it was well known among the more "seasoned" Bethelites that most of the members of the Governing Body and the Writing Department had differences of opinion as to matters of doctrine. For example, Colin Quackenbush, former editor of the Awake! magazine, believed that all of the "144,000" (the heavenly class) must have been chosen by the end of the first century, for history testifies that there were millions of Christians even in the early years of the church, many of these having been martyred for their faith. Fred Franz, the fourth president of the organization, at times expressed beliefs that he had to qualify as his opinion, and not the general consensus of the other GB members. Yet, by the end of 1979, none would dare to admit such differences. Those who did were disfellowshipped.

  During the time that the Sanchezes were disfellowshipped and Ray Franz was put on trial, I would hear through the grapevine who was going to "get the axe" next. The junior members of the Governing Body took turns at defaming the characters of these "apostates" in order to prove their loyalty to the older members of the Governing Body. A popular Bible commentary (Barnes' Notes On the New Testament) was banned from the libraries for a time, as some Bethelites who had used it in their studies had seen through the shallow scholarship of the JW publications and criticized them. Revealing their insecurity over their own doctrinal foundation, the Aug.15,1981 Watchtower (p. 28, 29) stabbed at those who wanted to study the Bible without The Watchtower: "They say that it is sufficient to read the Bible exclusively, either alone or in small groups at home. But, strangely, through such 'Bible reading,' they have reverted right back to the apostate doctrines that commentaries by Christendom's clergy were teaching 100 years ago."

  The crux of the matter is this: The JW is not allowed to interpret the Bible, but must rely on the ever-changing interpretations of 14 men in New York, none of whom are Greek or Hebrew scholars, and have no business translating a Bible, let alone controlling the lives of millions of people.

  Christianity is meant to be an experiential faith. You come to Christ as your mediator, ask forgiveness for your sins, and you receive the "new birth" (John 3:3-7). Christianity is God working through man, not man working for God. When I realized this in 1979 after a study of Romans and Galatians, it soon became obvious that "grace" is the key to a life in Christ. I wrote about this early in 1981 with the tract, What Happened at the World Headquarters of Jehovah's Witnesses in the Spring of 1980? which reflects my feelings about the Lord Jesus Christ and the issue of salvation in the New Testament. I was then born again and experienced the blessings of the indwelling Holy Spirit, just as promised to every believer. The greatest truth I can say that has changed my life could be summed up in John 8:34-36 (New American Standard):

  Jesus answered them: "Truly, truly, I say to you, everyone who commits sin is the slave of sin. And the slave does not remain in the house forever; the son remains forever. If therefore the Son shall make you free, you shall be free indeed."

  One of my favorite articles I have written conveys the simplicity of the Christian message of salvation, entitled, "Rules for Christian Living." Please read it if you have time and let me know if it touched you.

  yours,
  Randy

  http://www.freeminds.org
• 

  Gerard

  Since one can not get all these wasted years back, I'd just wave them good bye and enjoy the rest of my free Christian life.
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  Tracy

  When it comes down to it.... If you fight, you could be labeled 'a bad association' or even 'apostate' (my one true dream in life ) However, if you don't fight and leave to lead your own wonderful free life, it leaves the door open to later help someone out who otherwise may have noone to turn to. Some other person who the borg have smothered would be able to reach out to you because you are still able to be talked to. They(the dubs) like "fights" but they fear that knowledge will reach those "fringe witnesses"... you do more good that way

  Peace,

  T
• 

  jst2laws

  Hello ljwtiamb

  What would you fight? The Society is a self perpetuating farce that will not go away. At best we outsiders can effect change in some of their most deadly policies, in which we have been successful.

  On the other hand, this web site demonstrates the great need to help confused, hurting, disillusioned JW's survive the exit process. So the question I have asked myself is should I LEAVE and forget it or should I keep in touch enough to support others?

  I think that is the best fight. If you had the power to destroy the WT tomorrow you would have 6 million desperate JW's either leaping into a more harmful cult or contemplating suicide. But if you help inform the public so few are drawn in and expose the WT so more can wake up and walk away you would be doing more to fight them than an outright attack.

  As others have said, only you can decide what is right for you. I tried to leave the JW experience behind but felt compelled to get involved in humanitarian works. I soon realized I can do more helping JW's become XJW's than any other volunteer work I might devote myself to.

  I suggest you leave, help a few others as you leave, and then get on with your life.

  Jst2laws
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  jst2laws

  Johnhag,

  Sorry I failed to welcome you on my comments above. I sympathize with your feelings and hope you find friends and support here from others who feel as you do. Hope to hear from you more.

  Jst2laws (Steve)
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  jgnat

  Maybe fight is too strong a word. As we all know, Jehovah's Witnesses are primed to expect "Satan's Attacks".

  How about leaving in a dignified way, leaving the door open for anybody who wants to know why you left? As jst2laws and others have pointed out, you can have a huge impact on doubting and exiting JW's.