when jdubs accuse!

by zev 16 Replies latest jw friends

  • zev
    zev

    tonight i was at a fellow jdubs house.
    there was 3 couples. my wife was in the can. somehow, in the split second she dissappeared, the conversation turned to pedophiles, catholic priest and how they cover it up. i did not/would not ever discuss this as my true feelings ALMOST BOILED out of me. i got up, walked over to the door and said, i don't mean to be rude, but i cannot listen to this conversation. they were remarking how the catholics cover up pedophiles and how the don't remove them, just reasign them. i almost went nuts! you know how bad i wanted to tell them, my dearest friends, that jdubs do it too! but i couldnt. it would have blown everything out into the open. i left...got on the bike, waited for wifey, and when i left i got no farther than a mile and i HAD to pull over and stop. i was so upset, i wanted to puke.
    she kept asking what was wrong, and when i told her, she said your so negative, all you want to do is pick on the negative things to find an excuse to get out. all you want to do is uncover the dirt and bad things. you should be defending the truth. puke. garbage. i'm so sick i could hurl. what kind of a messed up mind playing cult is this. 40 freaking years, and it comes to this!


    __
    Zev
    The greatest consistancy of the WTBTS is their INconsistancy.

  • Richie
    Richie

    Zev, I know how you are feeling.......My eyes were opened not so long ago when I have been discovering the real truth about the organization, where they blame what people are doing in this and that religion, but they are so blinded by what is going on in their own backyard.....
    Makes me think of the scripture where Satan keeps blindding the minds of the (un)believers??
    Keep up your spirits Zev..you know that you have more real friends than you think right here!!!

    Best regards,

    Richie

  • zev
    zev

    richie....thanks for your reply.....

    please edit your picture url in your profile. it references a picture in your a: drive and is driving alot of people crazy cuz all our machines are looking for you picture on our a: drives, dude.


    __
    Zev
    The greatest consistancy of the WTBTS is their INconsistancy.

  • Francois
    Francois

    Zev, what are you going to do about your marriage? It really sounds like there is a growing friction between you because you see the truth of this matter and your wife refuses.

    My parents are like that too. Refuse to acknowledge the truth that stares them, unblinking, right in the face. Of course, with them I can get up and go home. What can you do? Are you waiting on your wife to see the Dateline program? Perhaps you should tape it, so that after she walks out on it, she can later change her mind and see it later (just a guess).

    Francois

    Where it is a duty to worship the Sun you can be sure that a study of the laws of heat is a crime.

  • somebody
    somebody

    zev,

    I don't knowwhat to say about how physically ill you are becoming in trying to hold everything in. I'd advice you to come COMPLETELY clean with all your feelings about the borg seeing as how it's effecting you in more ways than one, but I don't know if that is the right thing to do or not. I'm praying that you can get some advice here from those who have reached the point you are at right now, and what they did.

    My best to you.

    peace,
    somebody

  • RedhorseWoman
    RedhorseWoman

    I can just imagine how I would feel in the same situation. Somehow, the JWs just can't see the forest for the trees. I think that if you showed them a court transcript proving that Brother So-and-So was a self-confessed serial rapist and/or pedophile, they would look you right in the eye and deny that Brother So-and-So was still in the "Truth". They would most likely begin discussing how horrible it is that people "change like that" when they leave the "truth".....even if the guy was at their Hall the previous Sunday giving the Public Talk.

    Zev, you have to figure out some way to get out of that situation. Knowing what you know and seeing the hypocrisy that continually goes on is going to eventually eat you alive.

    My offer still stands.....if you need to vent, you have my phone number.

  • zev
    zev

    frixtion? thats an understatement. she can not / will not see through it. to blind, frankly as i once was. there are alot of issues in the mix here as some of you know. i've set a time limit on them. begining of october, one way or the other, things dont change, then i do what i NEED to do. for me. for my sanity. for my health. for my life!

    what people can never understand, {the borg, not you fine peeps} is i didn't go looking for this stuff. it FOUND me, i wasn't looking for it. it was acomplete accident i discovered the stuff i did. i did pursue it in the end to see what was what. i had too.

    i told my youngest sister last week, it should have been harder to uncover the lies, coverups and deceptions. i should have had a tough time. if the "truth" was truth, i should have kicked up the carpet, exposed the underbelly of the borg, and found nothing. but thats not what happened, i found the "dirt" because it WAS ther to FIND. has been all along, i was just to blinded by the borg programing to see it.

    gwen, i really appreciate your concern. thanks for being such a dear, kind, friend. and for your support. if only everyone could have such true friend like you. thank you.

    redhorsewoman. in a recent computer glitch, i lost all my mail, all my friends wonderfull addresses, everything. i've fixed what was wrong, bu i lost so much. i would appreciate more mail, to those who read my stuff, drop me an email so i can gather the addreses again. sorry, it was an accident, honest....and i'm usualy so good about backups and stuff. i'm such a nerd
    even nerds do stupid stuff sometimes.

    thanks one, and all.


    __
    Zev
    The greatest consistancy of the WTBTS is their INconsistancy.

  • zev
    zev

    a thought accured to me.....

    run the xfiles, only sub the fbi for the wtbts.

    the truth is out there?
    trust no one?

    words to live by, agent mulder. skully thought he was a crack pot. so did skinner. but when the evidence hit them square in the face, could they deny the evidence?

    no.

    protect your children.
    watch your backs.

    trust no one!

    zev, the hurling class


    __
    Zev
    The greatest consistancy of the WTBTS is their INconsistancy.

  • troubled
    troubled

    Hi Zev,

    I read your post, and I'm sorry to hear about your bad experience. I, too, have heard the friends at the Hall talk about how terrible it is that the Catholic Church covers up the activities of pedophiles. And it is always stated so self-assuredly, without any inkling that these things go on in Jehovah's organization too. It's a display of trust and naivety. I hate to admit, I've done (and said) the same things about the Catholic priests myself, in ignorance.

    As one who was sexually abused as a child (not by a JW), I am disgusted whenever I read about pedophiles, particularly when they are allowed to repeat their actions or their activities are kept secret. So you can imagine how sick I felt at seeing information indicating that it might be happening in our own congregations! I'm having a hard time believing it. It makes my stomach hurt. But I am researching into it, as I have to know the truth.

    I agree with the above suggestion: to tape the upcoming Dateline program when it airs. And encourage your wife to watch it. Or, if you know she will protest to watching it, plan ahead to be home and have the TV on that station when it is going to air. Then say, "Hon, come take a look at this!" That's what I plan to do with my husband.

    Even though my hubby is disgruntled himself about things going on in our congregation, he is very against any type of negative-JW info from the outside, Internet info, etc. He considers it all "apostate crap." So I've not shared anything with him yet that I've read/learned about the Society. However, I will ask him to view the Dateline program. He knows I was sexually abused as a child (not by a JW), and how much I've struggled with this. If he sees the Dateline program, he will either be disgusted/shocked to learn it is going on in Jehovah's organization, or he will not believe it and say it is just a bunch of "apostate lies." I'm not sure which. I'll be curious to know how your wife reacts.

    I can empathize with your situation with your wife, and empathize with your wife as well. I myself have been very innocent/naive to any wrongdoing in the Hall. And if I ever got that disconcerting feeling, that knot in my stomach, or a doubtful thought, I put it out of my mind immediately, feeling intense guilt and disloyalty to Jehovah and his organization. I remember hearing others make negative statements and thinking "They're just spiritually weak" or "Satan's just trying to discourage them." So I understand where your wife is coming from. At the time, it seemed the RIGHT thing to do to just ignore ANY negative talk, however justified.

    Your wife probably feels 100% that by refusing to acknowledge wrongdoing in the organization, she is doing what is "right" and being loyal to Jehovah. Reading over your post, I can't help but think that, unless/until SHE gets to a (mental/spiritual) place where she can open her eyes and see things realistically (both the good and the bad), without feeling guilt or disloyalty, you won't be able to FORCE her into that place. Trying to, before she's ready, might only make it worse for both of you. She will only think you spiritually weak, negative, and misled. Maybe when the Dateline program airs, the time will be right for you to approach her about this matter again.

    Maybe when the time is right, you could ask her to consider these questions (some of the things I've been asking myself, as I wrestle with the "loyalty to those taking the lead/loyalty to Jehovah/loyalty to the standard of Truth" battle in my own mind):

    The Bible's describes Jehovah as the God of Truth who cannot lie, how he hates deception, etc. Does Jehovah would consider it "loving" to overlook gross wrongdoing in our congregations? Did Jesus do it in the first century? Will Jehovah do it at Armageddon? Do we overlook gross wrongs in other religions? Does Jehovah want us to follow a double standard? If something is true, does turning our back and closing our mind to it make it go away?

    Yes, the Bible says to be submissive to those taking the lead. But it also denounces those carrying on a lie or covering over deception. Perhaps we have a moral obligation to expose gross wrongdoing in our ranks when we become aware of it. The Society asks us to report gross wrongdoing in publishers (if they don't confess). Doesn't the same standard apply to all in the congregation, regardless of their position? After all, our loyalty to any man is still relative to our loyalty to God.

    Of course, there's the flip-side view: to forgive 77 times, turn the other cheek, don't pick at the straw in your brother's eye when there's a rafter in your own, chalk things up to human imperfection, etc. But somewhere there must be a line between forgiving minor offences and overlooking gross wrongs that destroy people's lives. Personally, I don't know where that line is. Hence, just stuck in the "thinking, weighing, researching" mode. Yet I keep thinking that, as a God of Truth, Jehovah would expect us to hold ourselves up to the same light of scrutiny that we shine on others, the same standard of truth. After all, we call our religion "the TRUTH." And the subject of pedophiles in the congregation seems, to me, to be a "rafter" and not a "straw."

    I don't know if any of this will help you or your wife. I'm just thinking out loud and trying to reconcile some of these same issues in my own mind. I've not left Jehovah's organization. I've not make any hard fast judgments. I'm just trying to keep my eyes and mind open, and apply to myself what I ask others to apply to themselves when I go to their door. Maybe in time, your wife will see that is not such a terrible sin after all, but what Jehovah expects us to do.

    Perhaps with time, your wife will be in a place where you can talk honestly and openly about the organization, without guilt and fear shutting everything down communication. That's what I'm hoping for your marriage anyway. That's what I'm hoping for mine.

    As a still-active JW who WANTS to believe in the goodness and altruism of Jehovah's organization, I can understand where your wife is coming from. Even now, I'm still hoping to find good, solid explanations for the info I'm finding. I want VERY MUCH for the allegations to be wrong. The only difference between me and your wife is that I've gotten past the point where I feel I CANNOT look at the evidence from both sides, without feelihg horribly guilty and disloyal to Jehovah.

    As I said, if I can prove the allegations are false, I will be so very happy and relieved. If not, it will be incredibly sad and painful. My whole world would seem to crumble before me. But either way, if I'm basing my life on this, I need to know the truth. And maybe your wife will see it this way too, in time.

  • RedhorseWoman
    RedhorseWoman

    Troubled, I can empathize with your position very well, since I was in the same position for many years.

    I can truthfully tell you that whatever you decide to do, Jehovah will be there for you. He does NOT reside within an organization, and if you feel at some point that you can no longer in good conscience support the WTBTS (as I did), He will still be there for you.

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