is the gun responsible or the one who fires it?

by zen nudist 15 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  Flash

  1) that all sounds nice if you ignore the fundamental problems, namely, God did intervene and supposedly knew the consequences of his actions.

  2) ...from the story there is no hint Abel would have been murderered without this intervention.

  3) ...so why did God intervene and then not stop Abel from being killed, but only show up afterwards...and then be so odd about the punishment.

  1) God was not wrong to choose to counsel Cain. Cain (like us) had free will in choosing to listen to God or not...the fault and failure was Cains alone.

  2) You could say that or you could say that God 'knew' sin/murder was crouching/waiting for Cain and so He chose to warn him so Cain could avoid a fall if he chose too.

  3) Free will, free will, free will...When it come to obeying God or not WE HAVE FREE WILL. The punishment was God's to choose. If you think its odd, thats your right.
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  prophecor

  It's the BULLET......................................
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  funkyderek

  Cain's sacrifice of vegetables was rejected. YHWH - as always - only wanted blood. Presumably, Cain thought that his brother would be an even greater sacrifice than a lamb. But he learned the hard way, there's just no pleasing some people.
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  EvilForce

  Funky....LOL
  
  Well Cain obviously was a farmer therefore didn't have time to go to the 5 meetings a week....and you see what happens? You don't make it to all the meetings you end up killing people.
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  zen nudist

  1) God was not wrong to choose to counsel Cain. Cain (like us) had free will in choosing to listen to God or not...the fault and failure was Cains alone.

  2) You could say that or you could say that God 'knew' sin/murder was crouching/waiting for Cain and so He chose to warn him so Cain could avoid a fall if he chose too.

  3) Free will, free will, free will...When it come to obeying God or not WE HAVE FREE WILL. The punishment was God's to choose. If you think its odd, thats your right.

  personally I dont believe in this mythical freewill.... however assuming for the moment that it is real... can you say God was blameless for setting this all into motion, after all if God had not intervened, there would seem no reason why Cain would have killed Abel.... and unless you think God is an ignorant dolt, surely he would have known what Cain would do...and that brings up the point of why does God show up AFTER Cain has killed Abel, rather than just before to stop him?
• 

  Flash

  ...can you say God was blameless for setting this all into motion,

  I don't agree that He set it into motion. Rejecting Cains offering doesn't make God guilty of anything. Cain (like ourselves) was responcible for controling his emotions. Just because his feelings were hurt he decides to kill his brother?? What would a person like that do if something really serious happened to him???

  1) ...after all if God had not intervened, there would seem no reason why Cain would have killed Abel

  2) ....and unless you think God is an ignorant dolt, surely he would have known what Cain would do

  3) ...and that brings up the point of why does God show up AFTER Cain has killed Abel, rather than just before to stop him?

  1) I don't believe our powers of understanding are anything compared to that of our Creator. I can believe He can see deeper into an individual than we can and 'know' things about him or her that we can't.

  2) Jesus told us to pray that we wouldn't 'be lead into temptation,' so it is not beyond God's authority to arrange for us to be tempted, even so, I don't believe that was the case here reason being, God went out of his way to warn Cain to gain control of himself.

  3) Why? To render judgement, that is His right, and again, because of the Rebellion the rules of life have changed. He is allowing Lawlessness to prove itself a fatal existance. To do that, God has to allow all that makes up lawlessness to exist and be carried through to its completion. Otherwise He could never show the superiority of the Law of Selfless Love over the Lawlessness of Selfish Pride.