Is it morally OK to try to free people from the WTS and how?

by DannyBloem 43 Replies latest jw friends

  • DannyBloem
    DannyBloem

    HI Belle,

    What ere some of the evidences that there was not a global flood as described by the bible and believed by the witnesses?

    The location of live on earth. De JW believe is hat all life except for the fish and lower life forms was destroyed and came from two pairs brought into the arc.

    Consider the fishes, there are a lot of lakes containing fish. Studies have indicated that fishes in lakes close to each other are more related then those farther away. Some can still interbreed, others can’t. The evolution process takes much longer for this to happen. There are even places where fishes of some kinds can interbreed with both kinds in the lakes beside them, but they fishes in the lakes beside them can not interbreed. (This is also a very strong point to prove that the evolution process does actually happen)

    Same for other species for example the mammals in Australia.

    A piece of more hard evidence comes from drilling samples of ice on the poles. Like the rings in the trees where you can count how old a tree is, there are also ‘rings’ in the ice. The seasonal changes cause the ice in winter and summer to be different, and also the (micro)organisms that are trapped in the ice are different. So, those layers can just be counted. This becomes increasingly difficult for longer periods as the ice is more compact if older (more pressure on top).

    Anyway this has been done and the estimated age of some of the core samples are 100000 years. It is pretty accurate until 7000 years and it becomes more and more difficult to get the exact age when older. Still it proves that there this part has never been underwater for a long time. The ice would have been melted a very different layer of ice would have been the result.

    If the rain was not salt (most logical) the salt-water fishes would be in deep trouble. Salt water is heavier and the mixing occurs slowly. They couldn’t stay deep because of pressure and could not stay on top because of lack of salt.

    More evidence in the animals.

    Many species can’t travel very well or fast and some are restricted to colder climates. Noah must have got them from far away.

    A lot of species can only survive without predators and are only found on islands where no (big) predators are. God must have got helped them to the ark and put them back afterward.

    After the flood the animals would have starved to dead. Some animals are very specific in what they eat.

    Tree ring dating. This goes back until about 10000 years. No evidence of a global flood here.

    There is evidence of other water catastrophes, natural dam breakings etc. Why there is found evidence for that and not for the great flood. If it really happened the evidence must be overwhelming.

    If really believed God must have interfered at so many places. Where the water went, can’t be only natural. (Lifting the mountains etc). Where the water came from also. And must have given extra protection for Noah when this kind of catastrophes happened. What is the use of the ark then?

    It is clear how the mountains came to be, because of continental drifting.

    Then what is called the evidence of the flood?

    Legends and Myths.

    Answer: there have been local floodings (very recently one in Indonesia). Of course those things give rise to myths and legends. There is some evidence that there was probably 9000 years ago a local flood in the black sea area. Flooding is one of the most catastrophic events on earth (even today). So no wonder that many tribes have stories about them.

    So the possibility that those myths came from a local good, however

    note that the bible does not speak about a local flood:

    1) The time the bible says Noah was in the ark

    2) The necessity of Noah to go in the ark the first place

    3) The necessity of birds and animals to go inside the ark

    4) The bible says the water were above the mountains

    5) Gods promise to never to it again would mean nothing for a local flood (and would be untrue)

    6) The bible says all people come from Noah

  • Rabbit
    Rabbit

    Danny,

    I liked your breakdown about the problems explaining the Bible's Flood. You mentioned fish, that made me think. There are thousands of different species of fresh water fish -- they would have been killed by the salt water in the oceans as they mixed together. And yet...they weren't. Not good for the bible story, huh ? Another would be insects...there are over 6,000 species of beetles, then all the flying insects like mosquitoes, bees, wasps, and others who would also have very specific dietary needs like blood, nectar from fresh flowers (Which were all killed by salt water, too).

    I don't think Noah had constructed aquariums or herpitariums or insect environments to bring onto the Ark to keep them alive.

    I like your ideas

    1) What would I give them back?

    The way I see it, you can't really take that responsibility upon your shoulders. After 35 years of being brainwashed by WT beliefs, I'm simply tickled I have the FREEDOM to look around and decide for myself what is best for me. Back when I was a regular pioneer for 3 years pre-75, I studied and 'brought in' to the WT several people. I married & then, with my JW wife, raised my kids into this shitty religion.

    I am now being shunned by those same children ! I feel like I have a moral obligation to get them out of a religion I know is destructive. If I can do that, they will then have the freedom I now enjoy of deciding for myself. Right now...all religion disgusts me, I want no part of any of it. Probably it's because I feel 'stung'. That will either go away or not. Either way...I want to stop another generation from making the same mistake I did by becoming a JW. Right now I have grandkids that are being indoctrinated...

    I know what you mean about the "not being as happy now as you were as a JW," that happens for a while when such a huge belief system like this is just not there anymore -- there is a void. Especially when JW's are taught to not look too far into the real future, because the "Paradise" is right around the corner. Our whole outlook about what our lives mean... change when we must face real life.

    Rabbit

  • LouBelle
    LouBelle

    Hi again DannyB (would have replied yesturday but it was a holiday & I make sure I stay away from my pee cee on those days)

    You give some very interesting & somewhat convinceable arguments. You've got me thinking & I'll probably go and do some more research on this subject. Trying to disprove these kinda things to people still in the faith is going to be tough...very tough.

    May I ask where you've done your research or if you could suggest some reading material.

  • DannyBloem
    DannyBloem

    Hi Belle,

    Most of the reasoning here is just from myself. That is that I have read most of it in the years and kept in in mind. I did study science, so maybe that is why.

    Actually the impossibilities of the flood of Noah is one of the reasons for me for leaving the organisation.

    A good book is: From Ian Plimer - 'Telling Lies For God' (Random House: Sydney,1994)

    and a lot of infor (both sides, objective) is given in WIkiPedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noah%27s_Ark

    Danny

Share this

Google+
Pinterest
Reddit