by lookingnow22 20 Replies latest jw friends
GodRules...try reading In Search of Christian Freedom and see if you're not affected by what Ray says in there. You'll realize that he's being truthfull once you start reading it. He has no reason to lie, because the lies would get found out right away. He quotes from the WTS's own publications, as well as the bible, and historical records.
Read it if you dare!
Peter Stride
Toronto, Canada
BillyGoat,
GodRules' response is fairly typical of the formulaic response of many Dubs to actual information. Anyone who leaves is clearly "presumptuous" and must have been wanting to "run ahead" like Korah. If only they "had waited on Jah" etc. The pre-programmed Dub mind has been trained to turn itself off when it hears such statements. Essentially the JW deludes him or herself into thinking that an explanation has been provided.
GodRules is right on one point; had Ray been allowed to remain a witness it would have done much good for the organization. Thankfully he didn't. More seriously, it is impossible to "do good" in the organization in the sense that GR implies; innovation is simply not possible in a system where rigid adherence to organizational rules and precepts is the most valued attribute in an individual.
T.
Many who are "unaffected" by the book, have not really sat down and read it. Some may read a chapter or two when someone calls their bluff that "they are not afraid to read anything", and even then they aren't paying attention to what is being said.
The conclusion is already made that it is "full of apostate lies", "he was bitter", "he wanted more authority/prominence", "he just wanted to do his own thing".
As has already been stated, it was all about doing what was right as far as people and lives were concerned when an organization required one to do otherwise.
I have to laugh at the idea of a Governing Body person having to "wait on Jehovah". The only people they are waiting on is themselves. If anything, Jehovah is waiting on them.
Path
I've said this before but I will say it again.
If Ray Franz' books, either one of them, had contained just one false statement, the organization would have slapped a lawsuit on him. So they did the only thing they could do to people like him that tell the truth, they spread rumors and label him an apostate.
In the organization, an apostate is considered the most vile of sinners. Murderers, pedophiles, adulterers, child/spouse abusers rank higher than apostates. That is just the worst thing you could be.
I originally decided to disassociate in January, 1994, due to my sexual orientation. However, I still believed "lock, stock, and barrel" all of the JW teachings [except I believed that there must be a problem regarding the teachings on homosexuality]. So, rather than start leading "a double life", or "bring shame upon Jehovah", I decided to disassociate while still celibate. The elders "encouraged" me to think it over. So, I held off disassociating for a while.
Shortly after I made this decision, I came in contact with an ex-JW sister. She told me about Ray Franz's books. I got "Crisis of Conscience" and "In Search of Christian Freedom". I remember when I first picked up "Crisis". I was so afraid to open the cover. After all, this was "apostate" literature. Then, I thought to myself "if what he brings forth are lies, I can easily disprove them against "The Truth". If he comes across as the Watchtower said all apostates were, i.e., "full of hatred and venomous lies", that too would show me that the book couldn't be trusted.
So, I started reading it. WOW!!! I couldn't stop. I kept reading several pages a day. I suddenly realized "even if I were straight, I wouldn't stay in this Organization." There was none of the hate that the WTBTS said would be there, all of the information was backed up, and from personal experience having been an elder at one time, it "rang true".
Yes, the book was one of several factors that helped me to send in my letter of disassociation with "a clean conscience", turning my back on the Organization, KNOWING that it WAS NOT God's Organization on Earth.
For what ever it's worth, I knew Ray personally as well as most of the players mentioned in his books, during my tenure at Bethel in the mid to late sixties. Any Bethelite who was there during this time knows, as I do, that all of what Ray relates is dead-on accurate.
It must be remembered that, to a man, all of the Bethel family members tarred with the ``apostate'' brush, wer among the most respected and hardest working. To my knowledge no JW apologist has ever succeeded in refuting any of the information in both of his books.
GodRules
You read the book and weren't Df'd? Wow maybe I'll read it
GODRULES,
he would have done much good in the Organization. Because of his own stubborness, he is now out and has no control over the Watchtower.
By this statement you are implying that (a man) can have control over the org. If it was Jehovah's org. and truly spirit directed by Jehovah then no man or men would be in control, Only Jehovah would. Jehovah doesn't need men. Men need Jehovah.
Looking;
It put nail's all right ,several !, for me.
Disengaged;
I'll lone it to you anytime. Just don't let it levitate around the house. Hahahahhah
HCM
God Rules;
Are you saying below that Ray Franz revealed truth about the Bible? If so why is the truth he revealed any less valid now? Including what was revealed about the organization in his books, the inner workings of the WT are abysmal and don't appear to be improving.
>"If he would have been patience waiting for Jehovah's time to reveal truths, he would have done much good in the Organization."<
HCM
