Apostasy - A Racist Movement?

by slimboyfat 81 Replies latest watchtower scandals

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  richard

  influential Black proponents: Edgar Foster and Firpo Carr

  'Influential'? How so?
• 

  Cat-er-daynightfever

  I see nothing but idiocy in your statements, SBF. Jehovah's Witnesses that really believe that God is not partial take that feeling to their grave even if they leave the JWs. Any mention of JWs & their racist comments after having left is just another fact to be added to the rest of the lies told us. I was under the impression that since God was not partial neither were the "anointed". I had no idea of said information published in the publications until I did leave. I tell you that I see more discrimination of social class based on how much money you earned and whether you were related to the elders/ministerial servants/pioneers. When I was able to see such quotes, it gave me more reason to believe that all the talk throughout the 80s that JWs were not racist at all was nothing but bunk!

  I have met many people who like to throw the back-door racist comments on those who've done nothing but respect all people. Frankly, I don't believe that an apostate movement actually exists to the extent that you are saying. Otherwise we would be seeing the development of another kind of Borg. Maybe there are Apostafests, but I have never heard of any one single apostate leader becoming a pastor for the rest. I don't believe that those who are truly sincere would ever say such things unless they were true. All-in-all, I think you are just trying to confuse the real issue that bothers you. I agree with the others. You are just trying to start a fight and waste our time.

  Just because we left the Borg, doesn't mean that many of our core beliefs are not the same. Like the Basic command, "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you." Wake up and smell the roses. Nobody here is making truly racist comments. They are just repeating what they've seen quoted and are appalled by the lies. Quit wasting my time!
• 

  Pistoff

  The truth is I have never seen a black apostate and only saw one hispanic apostate which was rene vazquez. The apostates that I have heard from on the net are usually white anglo saxon americans or europeans like carl jonsson. In latin america you wont see anything of this sort.

  I have never seen ANY apostate, let alone check the level of their pigment.

  So, where is the oficial list of:

  VOCAL white apostates?

  QUIET, non-influential apostates?

  VOCAL black apostates or apologists?

  QUIET black apostates?

  The whole premise is asinine.
• 

  Panda

  It has been my priveledge to teach and lecture in the PRC. What I spent many hours on with my students was learning the concept of the "human race," We are the only race of humans. No one is yellow, or black or ...ok I am really really pale but won't be white until I'm dead. So why insite hatred with psuedo racist psuedo facts? You are a foolish person if you think anyone takes you seriously. (Unless you are a serial killer loyal dub and you are looking for negativity and rejection in order to get off).
• 

  smelly onions

  black, british, gay apostate here

  You would be the only one I never met. SBF is right on the money. The apostate movement was begun by whites and its ranks are mostly white. By and large hispanics and blacks could care less about doctrinal discrepancies. Somwthing they told me themselves. They are less apt to question theology and when faced with contradictions they just shrug it off.

  Many hispanics have told me that why is the child molestation such a problem amongst americans. Here I'm speaking about the USA in general not the org. They (hispanics) have told me that hardly occurs amongst latinos here in the USA and in latin america. I didn't have an answer for him.
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  RichieRich

  Ok... lets keep these two apart...

  Can we lock this thread??
• 

  jimakazi

  Firpo Carr argues

  Who the hell is Firpo Carr and why should we give a toss.

  Your could argue the JW use of the term "apostate" is a derogertory term used by JW's to descriminate anyone who has left the JW's and doesn't agree with them. In many countries it's illegal to discriminate on the basis of religion isn't it?
• 

  AlanF

  Firpo Carr is nothing but a self-promoting horse's ass. He claims to be "of the anointed", yet is on his 4th wife. The others divorced him for treating them with extreme arrogance. He has to move congregations every few years because he wears out his welcome by conning the locals, but avoids disfellowshipping because he's smart enough to put the elders in an extremely awkward position if they take action against him. So, like a government supervisor who wants to get rid of a lousy employee but can't fire the moron because of government work rules, the elders just sort of pass him on to the next bunch of suckers.

  The fact is that most JW-critics (call them apostates if you like; it doesn't amount to a hill of beans) are concerned with all manner of human rights, no matter what race or color the humans in question are. There is only one "apostate agenda": to get the word out on the destructive nature of the Watchtower cult. If one insists that there's a "white apostate agenda", then it's exactly the same as a supposed "black apostate agenda". And let it be understood that most of these critics are acting on their own, being far too independent to form some sort of "apostate movement".

  The point of critics' bringing up racism in early Watchtower literature is not out of concern for racism per se, but to show that the God of non-racism could not have had anything to do with Watchtower literature. Carr's associating race with "apostates" is just another of his stupid tactics to promote himself.

  The fact that blows away Carr's claim is that some of the most effective online "apostates" are black. They simply don't promote their race, because it's a non issue. For instance, James Mitchell, when he posts on JWD, is extremely effective in getting the message across that the JWs are a destructive cult.

  The fact that blacks in American JW congregations are disproportionately represented compared to the population as a whole simply reflects the fact that Jehovah's Witnesses are a religion that tends to attract the poor and disadvantaged. Why is this so attractive? Because it offers the dream of getting something people know they probably can't get in real life. In America, blacks as a group are certainly classed by sociologists as more toward the "poor and disadvantaged" end of the social spectrum than are whites. But then, so are certain other groups. Why pick out blacks and ignore other disadvantaged groups?

  I'll tell you why: Firpo Carr's self-promoting agenda.

  Furthermore, nearly all of the most vocal JW apologists are white, so I suppose that must mean there's some hidden "JW apologist agenda" to put down blacks by excluding them from the ranks of apologists.

  AlanF
• 

  mrsjones5

  By and large hispanics and blacks could care less about doctrinal discrepancies. Somwthing they told me themselves.

  
  

  
  O.K. I just got done puking. Did all of those black people tell you that or just a chosen few? Smelly you sure love those blanket statements dont you? Darling you dont know what youre talking about. Please remove your large foot from your tiny mouth.

  Josie
• 

  EvilForce

  Smelly your simplistic and nim witted comments on this thread are as bad as a Dr. Suess book. Never tease a weasel, no never once or twice, no never tease a weasel, no it's not very nice.
  Your own limited life experience, world travel, and higher education show themselves quite clearly in your posts Smelly. You can take the boy out of the Kingdumb Hall but you cannot take the Kingdumb Hall out of the boy.
  Have you bothered to do ANY research into your comments before you posted them? NO!
  There are Meet Up ex Jo Ho groups around the world. There is both a large Brazilian and Mexican gay ex-Jo Ho chapters of A Common Bond. There are at least 7 sites in spanish for these folks that I uncovered in 10 minutes of google searching.
  Let's think for just a moment why we not be "overwhelmed" with apostates from Latin America? First off have you bothered to look up the figures at how many Jo Ho's there are in Latin America? There are a million in the USA. In the largest 4 latin American countries of Nicaragua, Costa Rica, Guatamala, and El Salvador, there are only about 90,000. On top of the pool being so much smaller....the socio-economic status of these folks is a fraction of America's. Jo Ho's tend to be less educated and poorer than the general masses. Many if not most Latin Americans cannot afford their own computer and internet connection. If they do use the internet it usually is at internet cafes.
  Use that God given brain of yours and put it to use before pushing the "submit" button next time.