There seems to be a certain set of stages one goes through. I think the final, and most nagging is the one you have described. You are pretty near 100% sure it's not the truth, but it's not really 100%, it's 99.9%. And it's that last .1 that is the hardest to get over. The stakes are so high, that one can't help but be a little extra careful. I love the point made by Reagan's husband. (I think I've got that right. somebody said it above) Ex-Mormons are going through the same situation, EX-everybody who's left any religion. I wonder where you got the impression that more study and service could help you pull out of it? Years of WT indoctrination? Just maybe.
Were you afraid that the JW's were right?
by jurs 21 Replies latest jw friends
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bboyneko
"Civilisation will not attain to its perfection
until the last stone from the last church
falls on the last priest"
Emile ZolaI dont advocate preist squashing, but you get the idea
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Helen
room 215 (interesting name)
I dont care if they are or are not..If they are I do not want to live forever with biased, ignorant, people (most not all) are this way.
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Helen
great story
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Kent
Hi Jurs;
I'm pretty sure MOST EX-JWs have had that fear. When you have been indoctrinated for yers, it's not THAT easy just to let it all go. It might be "one big realisation" as JanH said, but most people have a little personal demon sitting in the back of the head, whispering: WHAT IF......?A few years back there was a nasty autumn storm on the Norwegian West Coast, and in a town called Aalesund a guy came screaming into the welfare office - he had completely lost it. He had been worried by reports on hunger and earthquakes, and when this storm ripped the roof off buildings, blew ships on shore, he lost it. Paniced. ARMAGEDDON IS HERE!
It's easy to laugh at stuff like that, but most people I know coming out of the Watchtower DO have those doubts, or maybe more FEARS. WHAT IF?
The only way of getting rid of these things - and the only way of getting mentally healthy (!!), is to study. Study the claims of the false prophet in Brooklyn.
Study the Watchtower records as a prophet. Some record! So far 100% miss!
Study the record of their excuse of a "god". This Jehovah chap, supposed to be the editor of the magazine in the world who has printed the most false prophecies!
I'd say this Jehovah has been pissed since the day ol' Booze Rutherford arrived, organizing a new smugler-route from somewhere to heaven - drinking all day long!
I guess that's the reason for the so called "remnant" to grow in numbers as well. The poor bastards are dead drunk, steps outside a cloud, and falls down! So, they need a new idiot down here. That's how even people in the Senile Body came to be "anointed", remember?
Knowledge, my friends. That's what makes it. Knowledge - not superstitions. Psychological crutches; "Where do we go now??" - no use. Learn to stand on your own feet folks, take your own decitions, and tell the Watchtower, their redicolous joke of a god, the window-cleaning elders and the rest of the mindcontroled grown-crew to go f*** themselves! (I was a good guy now, right? I didn't use the word "fuck"!)
Welcome to the real world. It's actually real good. In the real world the "satanic" governments even try to handle pedophiles!
Yakki Da
Kent
"The only difference between a fool and the JW legal department is that a fool might be sympathetic ."
Daily News On The Watchtower and the Jehovah's Witnesses:
http://watchtower.observer.org -
peaceloveharmony
kent, i love you man!
....the mindcontroled grown-crew to go f*** themselves! (I was a good guy now, right? I didn't use the word "fuck"!)
hahahhaha..thanks for being you!
love
harmony"If God has spoken, why is the world not convinced?"
..........Percy Bysshe Shelley, English poet (1792-1822) -
AlanF
I got on the Net in 1992, before there were websites, and when Usenet discussions involving JWs were relatively rare. By that time and by my own research I had concluded that the JW religion was royally screwed up, so when I got involved in the Usenet discussions it was largely to express my findings. I found plenty of sympathizers, including a few ex-JWs or JWs on the way out, and a few JW defenders. The latter were stereotypically unable to defend their beliefs or their organization. Many of today's excellent ex-JW websites were created by people who came out of that ferment, which I would say had its heyday from about 1991 through 1995.
During the time I was researching the JWs, off and on from about 1980 but intensely beginning in 1990, of course I often wondered whether the JW's were right, despite their problems. What convinced me ultimately that they're royally messed up was finding that JW publications routinely lie, or misrepresent any number of issues. I even found that a GB member lied to me. Naturally, I put all this information on the Net so that others could benefit.
AlanF
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Dogpatch
I became convinced during my private studies in the Bethel library during 1979 that they could not be a prophet of God, simply by looking through all the Watchtowers from 1879 to 1979 and specifically several issues, such as:
How the anointed knows they're anointed
the truth about 1914
faithful & discreet slaveand I knew when I left Bethel they were just another religion. It took reading Romans and Galatians in a different mindset (one of grace) that convinced me beyond anything else they did not have the truth of the Bible. They actually became the ones who were the modern-day equivalent of the Pharisees, and I had been one of them. Here's my story:
Testimony of Randall Watters
(served at Watchtower headquarters from 1974 to 1980)
Having been a pioneer for two years and anxious to live at the hub of "God's organization," Bethel seemed like a wonderful place to be. From the start, I learned to run a press, printing the New World Translation, the Aid book, and many other publications. By 1977 I had been appointed a floor overseer and a Bethel elder. I was in charge of the presses that printed their Bibles, and help start an offset printing training school. Later projects involved helping to renovate the entire printing operation. Traveling regularly around New England as a speaker, I made many fine friends and enjoyed my work. I was convinced this was truly "God's organization," and was even zealous to report those who were entertaining thoughts contrary to those of the "faithful slave." I was well-known as an "organization man."
The big change in my perspective came in early 1979. On a business trip to Massachusetts with three other factory overseers, we were discussing the importance of faith for salvation and how the organization makes one's works the big issue (rather than true faith) through the counting of time (going door-to-door), keeping personal activity records, etc. From this time I began a study that intrigued me more and more, as I studied Paul's letters to the Romans and Galatians. At Bethel, I attended a Monday night Bible study after the family "Watchtower study." We used different translations of the Bible and went through the New Testament chapter by chapter. It was becoming noticeable to those within our group that there was a significant difference between studying what the Watchtower said about the Bible and actually studying the Bible.
Word leaked out that the Governing Body had discussed the validity of the 1914 date; or, rather, the issue was brought up for discussion but was quickly dropped. Also, the matter of the importance of developing one's conscience rather than living by a code of rules had been repeatedly brought up, and it seemed that a measure of freedom would be tolerated within the organization. Articles had been published that appeared to give the Witnesses more freedom in their consciences as to matters of employment and their private lives.
Take as an example the Oct. 1, 1972 Watchtower article on "Your Conscience and Your Employment." It was clarified that a person who worked on a tobacco plantation could choose to remain there or quit his job; it was up to his conscience. Then not a few months would pass by, and elders would complain to the Governing Body that the flock was taking too many liberties, and rules had to be laid down. Thus, the Kingdom Ministry of September 1976 stated on page 3 that a Witness most certainly "could not engage in the manufacture, sale or promotion" of cigarettes. Milton Henschel, a member of the Governing Body, once said over another matter of conscience, "If we let the brothers do this, there is no telling how far they will go." While in direct conflict with Paul's words at Romans 7:6 and Galatians 2:16-21; 3:10, the Governing Body deemed it necessary to lay down rules to "keep the brothers in line." Over and over I would hear it echoed among those in positions of responsibility at Bethel, "You just can't trust the brothers to themselves." In other words, the average JW's love for Jehovah was seemingly not able to keep him out of trouble, he needed to have rules, curfews and restrictions to govern all aspects of his life. Yet, my experience as an overseer told me otherwise. When you trust people, they feel comfortable and work all the more to get the job done. Unfortunately, this was not the pervading atmosphere at Bethel.
Up until the latter part of 1979, personal opinions could be discussed among close friends, and it was well known among the more "seasoned" Bethelites that most of the members of the Governing Body and the Writing Department had differences of opinion as to matters of doctrine. For example, Colin Quackenbush, former editor of the Awake! magazine, believed that all of the "144,000" (the heavenly class) must have been chosen by the end of the first century, for history testifies that there were millions of Christians even in the early years of the church, many of these having been martyred for their faith. Fred Franz, the fourth president of the organization, at times expressed beliefs that he had to qualify as his opinion, and not the general consensus of the other GB members. Yet, by the end of 1979, none would dare to admit such differences. Those who did were disfellowshipped.
During the time that the Sanchezes were disfellowshipped and Ray Franz was put on trial, I would hear through the grapevine who was going to "get the axe" next. The junior members of the Governing Body took turns at defaming the characters of these "apostates" in order to prove their loyalty to the older members of the Governing Body. A popular Bible commentary (Barnes' Notes On the New Testament) was banned from the libraries for a time, as some Bethelites who had used it in their studies had seen through the shallow scholarship of the JW publications and criticized them. Revealing their insecurity over their own doctrinal foundation, the Aug.15,1981 Watchtower (p. 28, 29) stabbed at those who wanted to study the Bible without The Watchtower: "They say that it is sufficient to read the Bible exclusively, either alone or in small groups at home. But, strangely, through such 'Bible reading,' they have reverted right back to the apostate doctrines that commentaries by Christendom's clergy were teaching 100 years ago."
The crux of the matter is this: The JW is not allowed to interpret the Bible, but must rely on the ever-changing interpretations of 14 men in New York, none of whom are Greek or Hebrew scholars, and have no business translating a Bible, let alone controlling the lives of millions of people.
Christianity is meant to be an experiential faith. You come to Christ as your mediator, ask forgiveness for your sins, and you receive the "new birth" (John 3:3-7). Christianity is God working through man, not man working for God.
also the synopsis of grace vs. works at:
http://www.freeminds.org/doctrine/rules.htmRandy
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ros
As long as I wondered if they might be right, I lingered "waiting on Jehovah", though I became inactive. My doubts had been accruing for years, but once I finally admitted one day: "this is it--its time for me to admit I just don't believe it"--that was it! I never had the slightest doubt after that (late 1970s) that they could not possibly be "THE Truth". My concern then came to be for those who had that fear you speak of, and for whatever reason which even I do not understand, my activities for exJWs have far exceeded any interest I ever had in being a JW.
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logical
Where can I get some of that fabric the Emporers clothes were made out of?