Garybuss said: "I seem to remember the Proclaimers book said Rutherford eventually tried case(s) at the Supreme Court. As an attorney, if it's true, it would be quite an accomplishment. Rutherford's rants and rages in print look to me to be the writings of a lunatic."
He did argue some cases before the Supreme Court. And lost them to boot! His most famous example being the "Gobitis" case were the SC ruled against the JWs on the flag salute (Covington would later get that one reversed when he argued the issue in "West Virginia Bd. of Ed. v. Barnett" [1943]). According to a book I read in high school, the judge seemed to feel that he could go before the Supremes with the same attitude that he had toward the audience at the conventions (talking down at them) and get what he wanted. It didn't work too well.
;-)
Jehovah's Court case -- Witnesses are killed who don't testify.
by garybuss 26 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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Forscher
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garybuss
heathen, The rewrite of history was clever to be sure. WAY too clever to be an accident. The Society hones their dishonest approach to the past and to the present and the Witness people I know, watch this and learn from this and they adopt it as their personal strategy for living and dealings in personal relationships. That's why it takes two hours to get a Witness to tell you his name.
Forscher, You wrote: He did argue some cases before the Supreme Court. And lost them to boot! Ha! I didn't know that. Funny! After I read 30 Years A Watch Tower Slave, I got interested in the German WWII history. I read the Declaration that Rutherford had printed and mass distributed in Germany. Rutherford tried to bully and intimidate Hitler and he made some BIG problems for the Witness people there.
I feel sorry for the Witness people in Germany who believed in and trusted Rutherford. Rutherford was extremely reckless with the health and well being of his followers. The Declaration stunt was repeated recently on a much smaller scale by the current Watch Tower Publishing Corporation's owners when they took out a full page ad in the New York Times denouncing the French government. It's like they don't care about the Witness people living in the towns in those countries they declare war on.
The Watch Tower's war in the United States was fought by the school children over the flag salute subject and the young boys refusing substitution military service, and the sick and injured who were obligated to refuse organ transplants and blood medical treatment while Knorr, Franz, and Henschel lived safe and warm in the New York apartments. I fought my losing battle for the Society on all three of those fronts. -
heathen
I read the Declaration that Rutherford had printed and mass distributed in Germany. Rutherford tried to bully and intimidate Hitler and he made some BIG problems for the Witness people there.
Yah and so much for being innocent as doves and cautious as serpents . Some body did post that and it was pretty sick how they beat up the jews in a way that looked as if the jews deserved their treatment yet the j-dubs did not in any way . Of course the jews rejected the WTBTS so it made perfect sense at the time . I know I was very impressed at some of the stories from those in germany that spoke of their near death experience while standing up to hitler peacably tho. I don't want to take away from their courage either but you are right , all that mumbo jumbo from rutherford only could have made things worse .
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garybuss
Heathen, The current Witness people criticize the Pope and the Catholic people for not antagonizing Hitler on purpose like the Witnesses did under Rutherford's directions. What the Witnesses don't like is the Pope showed discretion and prudence in not antagonizing Hitler on purpose like the Rutherford "Declaration" campaign did. That act of political defiance put the Witness people directly in Hitler's sights. There wasn't anything religious in the "Declaration", just threats and politics. It was a terrible thing to do to the Witness people, especially the children who are always victims whenever exposed to the Witness group. Rutherford didn't stand by the Witness people at the train stations in Germany handing out the "Declaration" along side his followers. He sayed in San Diego in his mansion with palm trees and servants riding around in his Cadillac.
I have MUCH more respect for the Pope and the Catholic people than I do for the Witnesses and their brand of religious politics. -
heathen
I have MUCH more respect for the Pope and the Catholic people than I do for the Witnesses and their brand of religious politics.
Sorry I can't say the same . The catholic church wanted to share political power with hitler . Their involvement in the situation I think is what moved hitler to hating the jews and using the swatztika . One thing I do have is a picture of catholic clergy giving the old one arm salute to hitler at least the WTBTS didn't do that . They did declare some sort of neutrality . You do have it right tho , if rutherford wanted to encourage or show strength in the belief structure he should have met hitler face to face and did a witness to him just like the apostle Paul did to ceasar and all the jews that hated him . He just felt "safe" sitting in brooklyn pulling strings with his followers .
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daystar
Interesting. I had never considered the teachings from that perspective, but of course, it makes perfect sense. I should have seen it before. Thanks!
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Malachi Elijah
Paul did not go to Caesar to defend Christians nor to convert his wife and family. He was forced and dragged there to save his life because he thought he could do what Jesus did and call the Pharisee a hypocrite and viper. So what if a JW stands before the Pope and calls him a viper? It turned out the man was not a Pharisee but was the High Priest, and he had to declare his Roman citizen right to trial before Caesar to save his life. On the way to Caesar he helped spare every person in shipwreck from the storm. Also Moses caused greater harm to Israel each time he went to Pharaoh so that Pharaoh forced their burden greater and punished the people for Moses approaching him.