When Jehovah's Witnesses do bad - Are criticisms of JW's valid? Part I

by rambaldi 102 Replies latest jw friends

  • John Doe
    John Doe
    Was I referring to a religion? Not particularly. I was referring people who were in a relationship with God. Which they were. Since Jehovah's Witnesses today are in a relationship with God, it is a good way to refer to that.

    Jane is a woman. Sally is a woman. Jane is pregnant. Since Jane is pregnant, saying that Sally is a pregnant woman is a good reference. Do you see your fundamental fallacy? Do I need to spell it out on a more elementary level? I don't mean to offend, I'm really trying to make sure you're following my statement, and I don't want to go over your head. If I'm talking too fast, just let me know, and I'll type slower. ;-)

  • John Doe
    John Doe

    Sorry guys, I'm stuttering tonight. This forum doesn't like Firefox very well. :-(

  • John Doe
    John Doe
    Just a thought that occurred to me while reading this thread. Wonder if he/she is counting this as part of their "time?" Isn't if funny how you people always go back to that? That and the thing about "You shouldn't be here". And talk about who is not original.

    And yet, you are still disobeying the organization in the same way. Who's not original? I pointed out that you are contradicting yourself. I'm still waiting for an answer or a justification. As a tip, starting any sentence with "you people" is inflamatory and is not meant to help anyone. Are you, as one of "God's people," supposed to be encouraging all you meet to come to the organization? Is flaming people on this thread supportive of your organization in any way? Oh wait, this is probably another mistake, no?

    Okay, I'm done for the night. I've got a test tomorrow that I'm going to be up all night studying for. Later.

  • aniron
    aniron
    rambaldi said: Was I referring to a religion? Not particularly. I was referring people who were in a relationship with God. Which they were. Since Jehovah's Witnesses today are in a relationship with God, it is a good way to refer to that.

    This cannot be so. JW's cannot have a relationship with God because according to their own teaching only the "anointed" are in any form of relationship with God as only they have a mediatorship with Christ, and so with God.

    You cannot have a relationship with anyone if youhave to go through another party to do so.

  • mkr32208
    mkr32208

    Adam and Eve were the first Jehovah's witnesses? Disregarding the fact that their was no official JW religion at that time how were they his witnesses? What did they witness and who did they witness too?

    "You will be witnesses of me to the blah blah blah..." So adam and eve witnessed WHAT? A bunch of fruit trees? A talking snake? Some angels with swords??? So then WHO did they witness too about all this mythical bullshit? They were the only two people around right so who did they witness TOO? Remember while adam and eve where having relations with god there was no sin yet so there was no issue of soverenty so there was no NEED of witnesses at that point right... So in actuality adam and eve were never witnesses and from the bible they didn't seem at all sorry for what had happened rather seemed to feel god was a dirty f*cker who had done them wrong. I think adam and eve were actually the first members of JWD!

    You said that they had a relationship with god and JW's have a relationship with god. Gay men hold hands me and my wife hold hands therefore I am gay right? Same idiotic logic applies! Also how do you KNOW that JW's have a relationship with god? Based on what?

    If the pope is caught with his private part inside an alter boy does that reflect on the catholic church? Would the WBTS have a field day with that info? So why should we have less fun with 130+ years of obvious lies deception child abuse failed prophecy drunken leaders and outright fraud?

  • Sunspot
    Sunspot


    I wonder if Rambaldi read my post? I'd REALLY like to see his reply.

    I wonder if he read ANY posts? There have been such excellent points made.

    I STILL would like to see his replies on this subject.

    I would also like to be 25 again. I wonder which will come first---his replies or the reversal of time.

    Annie

  • undercover
    undercover

    I haven't read every single response on this thread so forgive me if I repeat someone

    Ramwhatever, you said:

    Consider:The first people who were Jehovah’s witnesses were Adam and Eve. They were given this command:

    (Genesis 2:16-17) . . .And Jehovah God also laid this command upon the man: “From every tree of the garden you may eat to satisfaction. 17 But as for the tree of the knowledge of good and bad you must not eat from it, for in the day you eat from it you will positively die.”

    They had a choice. Obey and live or disobey and die. They chose to disobey. We see that they did disobey and they died. Why give them a choice is Jehovah’s servants cannot do bad?

    First of all how were A & E witnesses to Jehovah? There was no one to witness to. Just a nitpicky sidepoint.

    Now, the scripture that you quoted says that they must not eat from the tree of knowledge of good and bad. What was the punishment for eating of the tree? From that same verse it says "for in the day you eat from it you will positively die".

    What had the serpent told A&E?

    Genesis 3:4

    4 At this the serpent said to the woman: “Y OU positively will not die. 5 For God knows that in the very day of YOUR eating from it YOUR eyes are bound to be opened and YOU are bound to be like God, KNOWING good and bad.”

    Being free moral agents they had a choice as you pointed out. They chose to eat. What happened to them?

    Genesis 3: 17-19, 22,23

    17 And to Adam he said: “Because you listened to your wife’s voice and took to eating from the tree concerning which I gave you this command, ‘You must not eat from it,’ cursed is the ground on your account. In pain you will eat its produce all the days of your life. 18 And thorns and thistles it will grow for you, and you must eat the vegetation of the field. 19 In the sweat of your face you will eat bread until you return to the ground, for out of it you were taken. For dust you are and to dust you will return.”

    22 And Jehovah God went on to say: “Here the man has become like one of us in knowing good and bad, and now in order that he may not put his hand out and actually take [fruit] also from the tree of life and eat and live to time indefinite,—” 23 With that Jehovah God put him out of the garden of E´den to cultivate the ground from which he had been taken. 24 And so he drove the man out and posted at the east of the garden of E´den the cherubs and the flaming blade of a sword that was turning itself continually to guard the way to the tree of life.

    Now, who lied to who here? What the serpent said was true. They did not die and they came to know good and bad. God told them they would die that day. They did not. They were banished from the garden of Eden so that they couldn't eat the fruit that would give them eternal life.

    Now the question should be that since we are free moral agents why worship a god that lies to us?

  • DannyHaszard
    DannyHaszard

    Reg;JW 'wrongdoing' this flamebait speaks for itself

    Why is D.H. so bitter?2005-07-05 09:05:23tamartim

    Ever wonder why D.H. is so maniacally bitter? Loneliness and longing. Personal insecurities and general misanthropy led to failure after relationship failure. It's just easier to get through a rotten life if you can blame someone else (a misunderstood religion, perhaps?) rather than your own awkwardness and limitations. Read D.H.'s angry confused story: http://tinyurl.com/d4tx6 http://editorials.arrivenet.com/rel/article.php/4662.html

  • BluesBrother
    BluesBrother
    Consider:The first people who were Jehovah’s witnesses were Adam and Eve. They were given this command

    :

    In case nobody has said it yet. i have not the patience to read all of this thread

    *** w70 4/15 p. 249 Questions That People Ask About Jehovah’s Witnesses ***
    Since Jehovah’s witnesses are not a sect but are an association of men and women who put God’s service first and line up with Bible principles, they are part of the group of witnesses that began with the first true witness of God, Abel—

  • jgnat
    jgnat

    Rambaldi, regarding following the "truth". Let me know if I understand your reasoning aright.

    If people of old disobeyed their kings, following God's commands rather, they are in the right.

    The Governing Body and members of the FTS class today is the New Israel. The rest of the congregation is not New Israel. The newly formed nation of Israel is not the New Israel because God rejected them 2000 years ago.

    The Governing Body today follows the "truth".

    To disobey the Governing Body is to disobey the "truth".

    By this logic it is impossible for the Governing Body to be anywhere but in the "truth". Even though they claim to be imperfect men.

    Is "truth" an object that can be touched, held, moved? Or is "truth" a principle has no residence?

    Right so far?

Share this

Google+
Pinterest
Reddit