Did Live 8 or Live Aid, Bob Geldof or any of the artists involved do any harm? Did the make anything worse?
No they didn't.
So shut up criticising them unless you can do better.
Live 8! Like Jehovah's Witnesses, all talk and no possible action.
by free2beme 21 Replies latest jw friends
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diamondblue1974
I think some account has to be made about the personal costs to Geldof 20 years ago...a £1m phone bill which he paid for...in fact in an interview with some of those closest to him they mentioned that the Live Aid gig nearly bankrupted him; in my view the amount you contribute should depend on the amount you have, if you have more then you should give more, not necessarily all as one has suggested as that would be completely disproportionate.
The purpose of Live8 was to raise awareness and raise funds...the fact that its done this is a job well done to all involved.
Whether it does what it should will depend on politics and that is something we have no control over...
DB74
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jimakazi
Overly cynical - perhaps.
I too enjoyed PinkFloyd and many other artists. On the topic of if it was just a meaniless guesure - perhaps not; Bill Gates, who donates $5,000,000,000 a year to charity, endorses what they are trying as the only workable solution. But free2beme does have a point.
For instance how does wiping debt help the citizens of Africa if it results in propping up a dictator like Mugabe, an arshole who is bulldozing the housing of the poor? How does it help with the internal civil wars and genocide that has been seen. One of the major problems in Africa is tribalism - in which one tribe will try and dominate or eliminate another tribe, how does wiping their international debt solve this? Perhaps any wiping of debt has to be tied to ending dictatorship.
Another problem is pure ignorance. For instance the President of South Africa refuses to accept Aids is the result of HIV, Muslim nationas in Africa claim the Wests advice to use condoms to stop the spread of HIV is a plot to reduce the fertility of muslims. Perhaps any wiping of international debt has to be tied to decent sex education.
In many ways it has been the so called good intentions of the west with aid and medicine that has screwed up the African cultres and balance. It sounds callous - but if a whole heap of children survive that otherwise wouldn't have, when the worlds attention is focused on something more interesting - like the latest war - what then? Is the west going to allow them to immigrate and get a good job? Now that Aisian economys are growing perhaps African's can be the next cheap labour force for the west to exploit to make huge profits - if they can be stabilised. Even allowing for trade barriers [and the US has got to be one of the worst] to enable better acess to trade for African nations - exactly what are they going to export that people want?
It's all very well to preach an end to poverty but it's a lot harder to make happen. At least live8 will get some people thinking about the problem - and even if one country can be changed onto a course for the better, and it takes 20 years, wasn't it worth it?
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free2beme
Did Live 8 or Live Aid, Bob Geldof or any of the artists involved do any harm? Did the make anything worse?
Yes, they gave false hope. As a former Witness, you should understand the harm that does.
So shut up criticising me unless you can understand what I wrote.
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free2beme
For instance how does wiping debt help the citizens of Africa if it results in propping up a dictator like Mugabe, an arshole who is bulldozing the housing of the poor? How does it help with the internal civil wars and genocide that has been seen. One of the major problems in Africa is tribalism - in which one tribe will try and dominate or eliminate another tribe, how does wiping their international debt solve this?
It doesn't, this area is a mess and money is not the answer. You throw money in and these warlords take it for personal use or to genocide another tribe. They take prejudice to a whole new level of hate.Muslim nationas in Africa claim the Wests advice to use condoms to stop the spread of HIV is a plot to reduce the fertility of muslims
That makes me sick, AIDS is out of control in Africa. 1 in 3 woman will be raped in Africa, because the African males were told that to have sex with a virgin would cure AIDS.
Is the west going to allow them to immigrate and get a good job?
Were talking about a nation, whose people want to close the border with Mexico and Canada.
It's all very well to preach an end to poverty but it's a lot harder to make happen; At least live8 will get some people thinking about the problem - and even if one country can be changed onto a course for the better, and it takes 20 years, wasn't it worth it?
African hunger and bring it to the world attention is nothing new and yes it should be on the world's attention, to that I agree. My issue is that to truly help these people, who need it very much, we will need actions that will look a lot like what is happening in Iraq, with a military removing these warlords. The American people, and the world, want to see this happen with out bloodshed and it can not. We need to understand the problem better to learn how to treat it and when people think a concert that raises the attention of this issue is going to solve the problem. They are no different then the Witnesses who preach a peace to the world, but have no idea how to do it without someone else taking over. Someone else in the African problem case, is a military state.
Here is an interesting link on this http://allafrica.com/stories/200506290326.html
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free2beme
Another interesting link
http://friendsofethiopia.blogspot.com/
Quotes of note about what Live Aid did in Africa
Showering money, trucks and food on Mengistu’s Ethiopia entrenched a vicious regime and aided one of the most cruel forced migrations in history. Ethiopia was never short of food.
Conventional wisdom was to dump the West’s surplus savings and produce on Africa, and then to wail when the continent was predictably corrupted. At a rough estimate some $500 billion was tipped into Africa over the past 40 years. Most observers maintain this contributed to political instability and a negative growth rate.
... there were many good points made and I felt the writter was saying what I said too. Sounds good and yes they mean well, but the hope is not the action of cure and in the end, the Problem with live on. -
dh
Yes, they gave false hope. As a former Witness, you should understand the harm that does.
I totally disagree. The people who see the Live 8 shows and all the hype are us, not the prospective beneficiaries of the cause, so it's not like we get our hopes up for them to be dashed, because the aid is not for us. Do you really think Bob Geldof or Live 8 is even on the radar when it comes to the millions of day to day people starving and riddled with disease all over Africa? I think not. I do not think they give any false hope at all, because the average person who will benefit from their success (or failure), does not even know of their existence in the first place, or that of the G8 summit for that matter.
Being a former JW I know how to recognise people who criticise others who are trying to do some good in the world, not that it matters but I don't respect that very much, and I think that is just plain stupid reasoning to try to compare Live 8 to the JW's with a punchline like 'all talk and no possible action'. It reads like a cheapshot.
If you think Live 8 = 'no possible action'... please explain to me how you personally would go (or have gone) about achieving more?
So shut up criticising me unless you can understand what I wrote.
What was there not to understand? -
coffee_black
I hope they learned from the experience of "Live Aid". Yes, dh, they did cause harm. The money that was supposed to help the poor went to the corrupt government that used the money for their own benefit, and actually prolonged the misery of the people it was supposed to help.
Sure, it is wonderful to help others....just make sure it's done responsibly...and follow where the aid goes... and if it really does what is intended. I share the frustration that some stars use charities to further their own careers... If it was as simple as raising money, the world would have conquered poverty years ago.
Coffee
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Tigerman
Yes, it's a very complicated issue . . .however, the problem will never be solved by not giving. BTW the concerts were free and the artists did not ask for money. Money may have come from selling air time but so what? Even if you bought the " One " bracelets, is $10.00 too much to ask?
Cynical people will never solve the world's problems.
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coffee_black
Who said anything about not giving????!!!! The problem is that when it's over, the stars go home thinking their job is done and that they have accomplished what they set out to do. I doesn't end there. Follow through is just as important...but by that time the news media is finished with the story...sad. No, they didn't ask for money...but each received gift bags valued at $12,000.00 each. Add that up, and that alone would have made a wonderful contribution... I wonder how many did that. They all got a lot of airtime too... promotion that certainly doesn't hurt their careers.
They question I have is: When the dust settles, what is the real outcome? It would be nice to see media coverage of that aspect of it. Otherwise, it's just a concert that just makes everyone feel good... and our feeling good doesn't solve the problem. I'm for finding a way to get the aid to the people who really need it, and help them build successful independent lives... not just a temporary fix.
Coffee ...of the no longer naive class...