Paul?

by DJ 10 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  DJ

  I've recently been told two conflicting things from 2 different Jws. One says that Paul went straight to heaven at death and the other one denied that as not ever taught. Who is in line with WT teachings? Thanks.
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  greendawn

  Back in the eighties when I left they were teaching that all dead saints are dead until the first resurrection which already occurred according to their beliefs in 1920 or something. So Paul had to wait nearly 2000 years in the grave before getting back to life in the 20th century.
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  DJ

  Thanks greendawn...that's what I recall too. Do you happen to know where I can find that teaching quoted online from a Wt publication? I have a jw that has been saying that I'm lying....lol.
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  greendawn

  Dj I don't remember off hand a specific reference for this subject, but Blondie is very good at finding these.
  
  I checked at the only jw official site: www.watchtower.org and used the search facility but nothing came up.
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  gumby

  Look in ANY of their 192 page books, the Aid book, the Insight book, or any other publication that deals with "Resurection".....and you'll find they still believe it wasn't till Jesus set up his Kingdom and began to rule....after cleansing the heavens of Satan and his gang members.....about 1919, that the heavenly resurection took place.......including Pauls sorry arse.

  Gumby

  *forgot how to spell resurection class*
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  jula71

  This is one of the sketchiest of all doctrines. But the line is, after a 3 1/2 year war Jesus had the heavens cleansed and the 144,000 that were "waiting" were then raised in 1919. I remember there was something in the Revelation book about it, I'll have to look it up when I get home.......
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  DJ

  Thanks guys.

  Hey gumby....it's been a long time! Hope you are well.

  This whole Jw teaching flies in the face of the rest of the things Paul wrote about what he taught would happen to him at his death. Shame, the wt can't just accept what the bible says. Nuf said. Thanks to all.
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  Leolaia

  Too bad such a view conflicts with Paul's own expectations in 2 Corinthians 5.
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  tetrapod.sapien

  ya, i always thought it was 1919 for the re-erection as well.
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  jula71

  Here is all I could find :

  *** w82 4/1 p. 22 The Kingdom and the Resurrection Hope ***

  Time of the "First Resurrection"

  8

  The Scriptures link this "first resurrection" with Christ’s "presence [Greek, parousia]." (1 Corinthians 15:23) The apostle Paul writes: "The Lord himself will descend from heaven with a commanding call, with an archangel’s voice and with God’s trumpet, and those who are dead in union with Christ [starting from the first century and up to Christ’s coming to the spiritual temple in 1918] will rise first." Paul then goes on to say that the anointed Christians "who survive to the presence [parousia] of the Lord," and who therefore die during the parousia, will be immediately resurrected and "caught away in clouds to meet the Lord in the air." (1 Thessalonians 4:14-17) They do not have to "sleep" in the grave, awaiting the resurrection. At death they are "changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye."—1 Corinthians 15:51, 52, Revised Standard Version.

  9

  Events in fulfillment of Bible prophecies indicate that Christ’s presence, or parousia, began in the momentous year 1914. (Matthew 24:3, 7-14) Then "the kingdom of the world did become the kingdom of our Lord [Jehovah] and of his Christ." After this world-shaking event "the appointed time for the dead to be judged" came. This judging and the rewarding of those worthy began with those sharing in the "first resurrection" from Christ’s coming to the temple onward. (Revelation 11:15-18) Those anointed Christians who die faithful after the setting up of God’s kingdom are called "happy." Why so? Because theirs is an instantaneous resurrection, allowing them immediately to take up their new duties with Christ Jesus in heaven.—Revelation 14:13.

  10

  The resurrection of the entire number of 144,000 anointed Christians called to reign with Christ in heaven is appropriately called the "first resurrection." This is so because it precedes in time the resurrection to life on earth of mankind in general, the 144,000 becoming "firstfruits to God and to the Lamb." (Revelation 14:1, 4; James 1:18) This puts them in a position of importance, since no other humans can "be made perfect apart from" these 144,000 priests, kings and judges. (Hebrews 11:40b; Revelation 22:1, 2) Furthermore, it is superior to any earthly resurrection, the 144,000 being raised "in the likeness of his Christ’s resurrection" to incorruptible, immortal life as spirit sons of God.—Romans 6:5.

  *** w59 6/1 p. 347 The Resurrection Hope ***All these will share with Jesus in the first resurrection, he having been the first to experience it. Like him they must first have been born again and begotten to a living heavenly hope by God’s will and his holy spirit. They must have the witness of the spirit that they are God’s sons and, like Jesus, must prove faithful until death. Fulfillment of Bible prophecy indicates that the resurrection of these body members of Christ began when he came to his house for judgment in 1918. Only a remnant of this 144,000 remain, and these experience the first resurrection upon their death, even as Paul shows: "We shall all be changed, in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, during the last trumpet."—John 3:5; Rom. 8:16; 1 Cor. 15:51, 52.

  The dates are very vague, but these point it to be 1918......i always thought 1919 ?!?!?!